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Acmilan_tiny by The Wizard on in Rumors

No Fuku?:

The Padres are facing determined competition from the Cubs for Japanese outfielder Kosuke Fukudome. Growing indications yesterday had the Cubs willing to guarantee Fukudome close to $50 million. The Padres have offered more than $10 million per year, perhaps well above that amount, over at least three years.
MLBTR says Fukudome really wants 5 years, and the Cubs are having an internal debate about stretching their offer to 5/65.

No Legend?:

The Giants are further along in discussions for free-agent outfielder Aaron Rowand, having spoken to his representative several times since last week's winter meetings. But it wouldn't be out of character for Giants General Manager Brian Sabean to strike late and fast on Fukudome.
Hello Mike Cameron? Ryan Sweeney? Alexei Ramirez? Corey Patterson? Kenny Lofton? Jerry Owens? Brian Anderson?
*****
In other news,

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kenny lofton!?
well he would fill TWO positions, lead off and CF..... hahahaha
"We had a guy go into 2nd base as if his wife was turning a double play."

by The Deacon on Dec 11, 2007 1:30 PM CST   0 recs

Plus, Lofton
could be a mentor to all our young, 32 year old bucks.

by HulkSmash on Dec 11, 2007 2:57 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

If we are going to do that...
can Scott Linebrink give us back his $19 million dollars?

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 2:00 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

ive been asking
that since they signed him.
"We had a guy go into 2nd base as if his wife was turning a double play."

by The Deacon on Dec 11, 2007 2:03 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Based on what it sounds like Fukudome...
is going to get paid soon, the Japanese market is almost officially toast.  Next offseason, Japanese relievers will be getting paid just as much as current MLB relievers and there will be no more good deals like Iguchi, Okajima, etc.

And it is looking more and more like Kenny is going to go from signing Torii Hunter to having a mediocre starting CF'er (Jerry Owens, Coco Crisp, Corey Patterson, etc.).  If they bowed out on Torii Hunter, they will surely bow out on an unproven player in Fukudome when the bids get up to 5-years, $65 million.

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 2:00 PM CST   0 recs

Yeah....
I think the most likely scenario now is actually what Kenny usually does -- trade. The sox are willing to spend some money, but not the going rate for free agents (other than Konerko). So they trade for players like Thome, Vazquez, Cabrera who don't have small contracts but still cost significantly less.

The two obvious trade targets are Crisp and Pierre. I would guess that the odds are very strongly in favor of one of Owens/Crisp/Pierre being in CF in 2008. I'm going to go ahead and guess Pierre at this point....

by hitlesswonder on Dec 11, 2007 2:07 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

if KW
resists the urge to spend big money on a FA CF, ill really start to believe in this team.  ill use the ozzie guillen method of explaining how things are going to go in 2008 by saying, how could they really get any worse.  Can our hitting really be any worse than last year and can our bullpen really be any worse?  
"We had a guy go into 2nd base as if his wife was turning a double play."

by The Deacon on Dec 11, 2007 2:19 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Owens/Crisp/Pierre
All those guys are REALLY FAST!!!!!
"All this has done is put the Tigers in a better position to contend with us."

by ballyb on Dec 11, 2007 2:23 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Never. Never. Never.
"All this has done is put the Tigers in a better position to contend with us."

by ballyb on Dec 11, 2007 2:27 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Between those three...
I'll take Owens. He's cheap, and the Sox don't have to trade anyone to get him.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 11, 2007 2:28 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Personally I would too...
But it would be nice if Sweeney could somehow, someway find it in him to win that job.

by hitlesswonder on Dec 11, 2007 2:53 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

If we sign
Corey Patterson, Greg Walker can work on shortening his swing.
"All this has done is put the Tigers in a better position to contend with us."

by ballyb on Dec 11, 2007 2:02 PM CST   0 recs

SSH
your boy Wise has been officially DFA'd.
"We had a guy go into 2nd base as if his wife was turning a double play."

by The Deacon on Dec 11, 2007 2:03 PM CST   0 recs

Awesome...
Kenny should acquire him soon.

Link:

The Brewers also announced they have outrighted outfielder Laynce Nix to Triple-A Nashville and designated pitcher Matt Wise for assignment.

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 2:06 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Matt Wise is another good reliever...
that the Angels decided to dump for nothing.

Matt Wise:
October 6, 2003:  Released by the Anaheim Angels.

Derrick Turnbow:
October 14, 2004:  Selected off waivers by the Milwaukee Brewers from the Anaheim Angels.

Bobby Jenks:
December 17, 2004:  Selected off waivers by the Chicago White Sox from the Anaheim Angels.

What a horrible run of choices by Bill Stoneman.

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 2:15 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Another good one -- Joel Peralta...
Joel Peralta:
October 7, 2005:  Selected off waivers by the Kansas City Royals from the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim.

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 2:17 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Legend selling his Philly house
MLB.com: Torii Hunter, gone. Andruw Jones, gone. Aaron Rowand, going? As far as the Phillies are concerned, that appears to be the case, with the Philadelphia Inquirer reporting that the center fielder has listed his six-bedroom home in Garnet Valley, Pa., for sale.

by The Wizard on Dec 11, 2007 2:19 PM CST   0 recs

he's upgrading
he'd probably be selling it even if he re-upped with Philly.  He'd have the dough to buy a 12-bedroom house.  

He'll probably buy more dirt bikes too....  Oh wait...

Bears eat beets.

by Nordhagen on Dec 11, 2007 2:32 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

The Nutty Buddy
[QH]:
GROIN AND BEAR IT: Nutty idea protects the jewels

Oh, boy.

Or boys, as the case may be.

Former big-league pitcher Mark Littell has what might be described as testicular fortitude (for lack of a better term or one that might offend some readers; and if you might be one such potentially offended reader, you might want to stop right here and go to a different item).

Littell, 54, has developed a protective cup.

In a YouTube video [2:23], he has assistants aim a pitching machine to fire baseballs between his legs.

After impact, Littell's dignity -- as well as other things -- are intact.

''Yes, sir, folks,'' he tells the camera. ''The Nutty Buddy: It's mean, it's tough and it's right there for ya, every time.''

''All people have to do is try it,'' Littell says of the product that has the primary advantage, he says, of being anatomically correct.

Littell's company has sold 3,500 through the Internet. He plans to market the product to sports other than baseball and to women.

''They need them, too,'' he said.

Several years ago when he worked for the Kansas City Royals organization, Littell came up with the concept for the Nutty Buddy.

''I asked my pitchers, how many of you guys don't wear cups?'' said Littell, who once was smacked in the groin by a hit (but he said he always wore a cup). ''And half of them raised their hand,'' he said. ''So I went off on a little mild tirade at the time.

''Every 10,000 balls you throw, there will be one that comes right back at you that you can't avoid.''

Meaning you'd be nuts not to protect your ... sensitive area.

Not only does Littell stand behind his product, he stands in front, too.

''Let's get the CEO of every cup company,'' he said. ''You put your cup on, and I'll put my cup on, and we'll see who's left standing.''

I like the youtube link next to the video: send this as a video holiday card!

by The Wizard on Dec 11, 2007 2:50 PM CST   0 recs

If we strikeout on Fukudome
why not sign Lofton to a 1 year deal?  He basically matched his career numbers last year and played 113 games.  Granted, that guarantees that Owens is going to have to play, but it would be like doing the Erstad signing properly.  He's going to be as productive, approximately, as Crisp and he won't cost a shitload.
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 3:44 PM CST   0 recs

Nah.
Then you just play Owens.

by dantesox on Dec 11, 2007 3:51 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Why would you just play Owens?
if we're committed to paying the money, Lofton is cheap and is going to put up a .300/.370/.420 line against righties.  That's a huge value, especially for a team like ours.
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 4:37 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

value for what?
81 wins instead of 79?
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 4:39 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

If we're operating under the assumption
that Kenny wants as competitive team as possible, Lofton is an upgrade, is cheap and won't handicap us later.
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 4:42 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

he ain't that cheap
and you're basically proposing that we go out and acquire another CF in addition to lofton. this sounds pretty expensive to me.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 4:44 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

one that isn't getting 400 PA
is going to be all that expensive?  i think we're both aware that platoon partners, especially from that side, aren't super expensive.  he played 2007 for 6M and 2006 for 3.5M.  he's not generating a ton of interest either.

I really don't understand the opposition to signing Kenny Lofton unless it means not signing someone else.  Would you really rather have Crisp and be out a few prospects than Lofton and a platoon partner?

His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 7:26 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

suddenly he's not going to get 400 PAs?
where does that come from? and, coming off the year he had, he's going to take a huge pay cut? where do you come up with this stuff?
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 8:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

the guy on the other side of the platoon.
yeah indeterminate pronouns.
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 8:28 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

well it would make it harder
for the tigers to compete with us ;-)

by Jbasic89 on Dec 11, 2007 4:46 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

both owens and lofton
are lefties and hit righties better. if you're going to platoon owens, you may as well find someone who hits lefties.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 3:59 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

and
if you want to take it the other way, lofton absolutely needs to be platooned, both because of age and an allergy to lefties. so that means, if it's not owens, you'd have to find someone to play with him. signing him just creates another problem.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 4:02 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

signing him creates a problem
but it also substantially upgrades over Owens.  Finding a right handed adequate fielding CF is so hard?
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 4:40 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

again, why?
lofton will get at least the $6MM he got last year. now we're supposed to go out and outlay for another CF? and i don't want to hear about BA.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 4:43 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

you're not going to.
but is it really that hard to find someone who can OPS .700 against lefties and can adeqautely fill center field?  and is that going to cost that much?  
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 7:39 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I'll say it again -- it's time for the Owens era
The only reason to bring in someone like Lofton would be to flip him at the deadline. But given how tightly people guard their prospects, I doubt that's worth it now.

I have say I'm surprised that Williams apparently won't give out 5/$75M to either Fukudome or Rowand after already committing to Linebrink  trading Garland for Cabrera. Owens or Pierre essentially assures the Sox of getting sub .700 OPS out of CF again.

by hitlesswonder on Dec 11, 2007 4:11 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

flipping him
seemed to work quite well for texas not five months ago.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 4:13 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

You're right!
I didn't realize Max Ramirez was a real prospect, but you're right.

So, is $3M and not getting to see Owens in CF worth  paying for someone like Ramirez?  

by hitlesswonder on Dec 11, 2007 4:51 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

it's more than $3M
i'd also say that, while ramirez is nice, i think your point is probably largely correct in that i wouldn't expect such a payoff for lofton this time around.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 4:54 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Well...
the commitment to Linebrink, although too long, isn't going to handcuff the club, and Cabrera will almost certainly be a type-"A", so even if the White Sox let him walk after 2008, he'll net a draft pick or two. Fukudome and Rowand will require a long-term, expensive commitment that probably wouldn't be in the best interest of the club.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 11, 2007 4:29 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Still...
Linebrink:
  1. It cost the Sox a second round pick
  2. The NTC and probable poor performance will make him hard to move; it'a significant misuse of resources.
Cabrera:
  1. Garland could have brought back at least a B prospect (e.g. someone like Chris Carter)
  2. The Sox only get picks if they offer Cabrera arbitration -- we'll see if that happens.
Those are pretty bad moves if KW gives up now...not that it might not be wise to do so. At some point I guess you have to stop buying a plummeting stock and start selling. But I don't think paying big bucks for a .790 OPS in CF in the current market hamstrings the team any more the the two previous moves have. Arguably less so -- the dollars and years are more daunting, but I'd be surprised in either Rowand or Fukudome collapsed in the Cell. They would have value next season in a trade, even if the Sox have to kick in some money.

Plus, signing ARow or Fukudome would mean Gio for Pierre/Crisp wouldn't happen.
 

by hitlesswonder on Dec 11, 2007 5:02 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

But it would mean...
a commitment until 2012 to a player entering the decline phase of his career. Right now, the White Sox have two players under contract past 2010 - Mark Buehrle and Scott Linebrink. That's an enormous amount of financial flexibility, and bringing in an expensive, aging free agent right now is essentially flushing that flexibility down the toilet. It would be worthwhile if the Sox were a player or two away from contention, but they aren't.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 11, 2007 5:15 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Why the Christ does everyone
assume that Fuku will enter the "declining phase" of his career in 2012?  Would someone please get #'s on Ichiro, Matsui, and Thome (just to be diverse) and see what their #'s look like post age 34?  Why generalize that someone in almost their mid-30's is automatically declining?  Conditioning, diet, managing playing time (days off, match-up issues, etc.), and longevity issues in general meam 34 ain't what it used to be.  And especially a 34-year old NOT subjected to the MLB grind (I would venture to say the Japanese baseball schedule is slightly less rigorous) might compare favorably to an "average" 34-year old.

Which is why I wanted Ichiro at $20MM/year.  Fuku is less proven, coming off elbow tweaking, but I'd be less circumspect re: "age" issues.

I'm going to read my new AARP issue with Caroline Kennedy on the cover.  And Prince turns 50 this next year, goddammit.  You should all have his energy!

Attica, Attica!

"I can't give you a dollar if I don't have 50 cents. Decisions are made awfully easy for you."

by winningugly on Dec 11, 2007 8:16 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

And the Stones, Who and
even Led Zep still rocked live in London last night... (watched like 6 hours of them last night on VH1 classic... need to change the water now) so stop this age stuff.

I'm with you WU

by Brush Back on Dec 11, 2007 8:41 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

you just cited
two players who haven't played post age 34.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 8:44 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

and as for why
  1. everyone declines at some point. most decline before then. maybe he's an exception. who knows.
  2. his value at that price is primarily in him being a CF. while i think he could be an adequate CF right now and for the near future, i wouldn't count on it at that age. most/all of the guys who last as CF into their mid to late 30s are speed guys. fukudome isn't a speed guy.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 8:59 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Not every signing can be Buehrle
Under market price, reasonable years...if you demand perfection you'll get almost no one.

Look, I don't think signing Fukudome or Rowand is incompatible with building a better team in 2011. There's a few reasons why such a signing wouldn't be so bad:

  1. Prevents prospects being dealt for Pierre/Crisp
  2. Signing either has minimal impact on the draft this year (Rowand would lose the Sox a 3rd rounder, I think...) -- better to sign a type A this year than next.
  3. The Sox need talent, and if they can acquire either of those guys without a NTC and for less than Hunter they should be tradeable the next two years.
  4. If its not used, is the "Hunter" money available for the draft or next year? If it would be  then you might be right. But if that money disappears if not used then I say sign a CF.
So, "big" money for a CF may not be ideal, but I really don't see it as a crippling move at all and it seems much better than some alternatives.
 

by hitlesswonder on Dec 11, 2007 8:39 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

I think you guys are underestimating
what Lofton's skills are right now.  If it's a few million and we don't really care about money at this point, he's going to put up a .300/.370/.420 line against righties.
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 4:39 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

So what?
What good does that do the White Sox?

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Dec 11, 2007 4:44 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

It means they don't have to play
Jerry Owens.  Who has a problem with that?
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 7:29 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

no
One player is 27 next year, has 365 ABs with a 67 OPS+.

Another player is 26 next year, has 416 ABs with a 61 OPS+.

That 2nd player also plays fantastic D and was once considered a prospect.  I don't see why Owens gets the shot over BA.  I understand what probably will happen, but it doesn't mean we should just agree to that.

Go Badgers!

by shaftr on Dec 11, 2007 4:54 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

who is "we?"
we can sit here and wax poetic about what should happen. or we can accept reality and talk about that. the former has been beaten to death already.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 4:57 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Well...
"I don't see why Owens gets the shot over BA."

What's so hard to understand?  BA HAS BLOND CURLY HAIR.  And HE DOESN'T FLAGELLATE HIMSELF WITH A BASEBALL BAT WHEN HE STRIKES OUT.

Look, if we're all wishing that Ozzie's personality conflict with BA wouldn't prevent him from playing the best player next year, could you at least throw me a bone and wish for a pony for my daughter?  We have a quarter acre, and I think that's enough room for it.

by BridgeportJoe on Dec 11, 2007 5:00 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Joe, you're missing the point
brian, he not real fast. and he not master of leadoff position.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/owensje01.shtm

by larry on Dec 11, 2007 5:04 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

About four clicks already this week...
I don't want you to get a big head.

And it's true that with his speed on the bases, Jerry does often bait the pitcher into making errors.  One could even say that he is the Master Baiter.

by BridgeportJoe on Dec 11, 2007 5:08 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Master Baiter
Hey! I used that line in a thread last week!
As for BA, you're preaching to the choir. And never ever forget that he killed a lion with his bare hands. Don't get more manly than that despite Cowley's blatherings.
It should be called Bill Veeck Park!

by Chiburb on Dec 11, 2007 5:25 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Lofton sucks
in CF now. He was never particularly instinctive out there, and with his loss of speed he is no longer even adequate in CF. Defensive metrics agree. He is now a corner OF.

Mike Cameron is the guy. 2 year contract, still good defensively (prob. about league average now). Likely to do about what Rowand would do. Type B free agent so no draft pick loss. Sign him.

by bhoov on Dec 11, 2007 6:37 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Both PMR and UZR agree
with you, so I'm sort of backing off of Lofton then.  But I don't agree with everyone who preferred Owens to Lofton.  And I'm pretty sure I'd still rather have a worse defensive CF with Lofton's offense than Owens.  

Then again, Rob Mackowiak's 2006 CF rated better than Lofton's according to PMR.

Also: Cameron has been about 4 outs above average for the last two years.  I have no idea how that translates to runs or wins.

His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 7:53 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Rowand to the Giants?
Sounds like Sabean's undertaking a youth movement!
Stretch!

by stevegoz on Dec 11, 2007 4:27 PM CST   0 recs

Twins agree to terms with Craig Monroe...
Link:
The Twins and Craig Monroe have agreed to terms on a contract, the Star Tribune has learned. The Twins were facing a Wednesday deadline to tender Monroe a contract, and there was some thought they might non-tender him, cutting him loose as a free agent.

Monroe made $4.8 million last season. The terms of his new deal have not been released, but the Twins were trying to get Monroe to agree to a pay cut. Had they not reached a deal, they would not have had to send the Cubs a prospect to complete their November trade.

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 5:03 PM CST   0 recs

wouldn't want to see him leave
the midwest.
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 6:49 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

It's just past 8:00 A.M. in Japan...
so Fukudome could decide on a team and all of us will be sleeping.

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 5:10 PM CST   0 recs

not me
I am on Fukudome-watch.  Even if it takes weeks until he's standing behind a Cubs podium with his translator, I will stand guard waiting breathlessly.  I will pass the time watching anime and folding bits of paper into cranes and outfielders.

Because I must show respect for his decision.  Respect equal to his respect for the Japanese FA process.

And I want to be there the moment the Jerry Owens Era re-begins.

Bears eat beets.

by Nordhagen on Dec 11, 2007 6:14 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

FTW!
His little smile pissed me off.

by colintj on Dec 11, 2007 6:48 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

Bobby Petrino has resigned as Falcons coach...
to take the Arkansas head coaching job, according to ESPN's John Clayton.

by SSH2005 on Dec 11, 2007 5:25 PM CST   0 recs

He sucked as a pro coach
anyway
"Find out what you are doing wrong and STOP doing that."

by Tdogg on Dec 11, 2007 6:34 PM CST to parent up   0 recs

more likely, he just wanted
the $4.8 million a year the Falcons agreed to pay him.
Once and for all, the leadoff position is how Jenna Jameson decides to spend the first 8 minutes of video time, which has nothing to do with baseball.

by Toonderstrook on Dec 11, 2007 6:49 PM CST to parent up