Hu's on short?
It was another bad loss by a bad White Sox team that I don't feel like writing about, so I'll just make a couple of observations I looked up during the course of play.
- Jermaine Dye's 9-2 Sac-Fly DP was only the second time since the start of the 2005 season that the White Sox have turned a outfield-to-out-at-home DP.
- That was the White Sox 17th blown save this season in 92 games. While Bobby Jenks was on the receiving end of just 5 of them, he's been responsible for the last 4 of the Sox blown saves. In those 17 contests, the Sox have won just 3 times. I'm not really sure how poor that is. I was just poking through BB-ref's PI and thought it was interesting. Here's a breakdown of the Sox record in blown saves since 2000 for some context.
Blown Saves Record 2000 26 10-16 2001 20 9-11 2002 12 2-10 2003 17 6-11 2004 13 4-9 2005 20 9-11 2006 17 4-13 2007 17 3-14
Rather than recap the game, I thought I would take a look at possible candidates for the White Sox shortstop of the future -- because even as a (former) fan of Juan Uribe, I can acknowledge that he's one of the largest dead weights on a club that sunk long ago. So let's take a look at the top theoretically available shortstops around baseball.
Leaving out guys drafted last year because they're still too far from the majors for my liking, the list slims down very quickly. Many of the best hitters drafted as shortstops have moved position, including Justin Upton, who might be the best prospect in all of baseball now, Adam Jones, who Seattle won't give up even though they've now got Ichiro locked up, and former #1 overall pick Matt Bush, who was never a good hitter and has moved to the mound in a last-ditch effort to provide value from what looked like a wasted #1 pick from the start. Remove Tampa Bay's Reid Brignac, because they're not trading him nor are they in a position to acquire what the Sox would be offering, and Cleveland's Asdrubal Cabrera because the White Sox and Indians arent' going to make a trade, and I'm left with just 3 candidates; the Dodgers' Chin-Lung Hu, plus Yunel Escobar and Brent Lillibridge from Atlanta.
His bat doesn't have a much power, but I think you can partially discount his .264 average in AA last year because of a fractured heel, which he played through in the second half. He hit .407/.463/.558 in 86 Arizona Fall League at-bats to prove he was healthy (And we all know how much Kenny loves AFL stats). It seems like he was being showcased this past weekend with 3 consecutive starts over Kelly Johnson, during which he compiled a 6-for-13 mark. I could envision him being a .300/.340/.425 player at his peak, which shouldn't be too far in the future.
I wouldn't be upset if we acquired either Escobar or Hu. Though they both could surprise, I can't see either being middle of the order hitters -- and I wouldn't count on them being top of the order hitters -- but having a shortstop that doesn't have to hit last thanks to a sub-.300 OBP would be a nice luxury.
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The inhouse candidates
by The Cheat on
Jul 18, 2007 12:30 AM CDT
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Andy Gonzalez
by The Cheat on
Jul 18, 2007 12:32 AM CDT
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Ends up a utility player...
by hitlesswonder on
Jul 18, 2007 12:59 AM CDT
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6'0, 170 seemed about right
Then again, I'm 6'1", 205, so perhaps I'm not qualified to judge. Or maybe overqualified.
by Sox Machine on
Jul 18, 2007 6:48 PM CDT
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Hu
by hitlesswonder on
Jul 18, 2007 1:02 AM CDT
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Escobar
by stevegoz on
Jul 18, 2007 1:27 AM CDT
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D-Rays
by beautox on
Jul 18, 2007 2:36 AM CDT
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More on Harris
I think Brignac or Harris along with someone like OF Desmond Jennings could be had for Garland.
thoughts?
by beautox on
Jul 18, 2007 2:46 PM CDT
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I'ver been watching the Rays more often
I'd think he's better than any of the folks on our roster at this point. I think the Rays are delusional, however, in what they want for any of their talent - OF, SP, IF, whatever.
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 3:07 PM CDT
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Response
He'd still be a solid pickup in exchange for Garland, but I doubt Kenny's going to move a Vazquez or a Garland without getting a promising young arm in return. AA RHP Chris Mason would be a possibility there. Jennings is a long way from the majors and the Rays can afford to take it slow on his development . . .don't see him being moved.
by mrkupe on
Jul 18, 2007 5:33 PM CDT
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Escobar
by shaftr on
Jul 18, 2007 7:42 AM CDT
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Hu
by The Cheat on
Jul 18, 2007 11:34 AM CDT
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Hu's next?
I love Asian names. Good material.
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 12:51 PM CDT
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It's amazing how some people are just now...
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 18, 2007 7:56 AM CDT
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well... 2 1/2 years. His 2004 was very good
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 18, 2007 7:57 AM CDT
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Knucklehead (and I say it with a great
Look at the replay of the final out of the 2005 WS and remember what almost immediately preceded it. Juan is above reproach for 2005. He has been a liability this year and perhaps part of last.
2005 is in the glass case and ought not be disturbed, as it is a masterpiece beyond criticism.
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 8:07 AM CDT
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Let us not forget
I think Juan can be very good when he wants to try, but I fear he is playing "lazy" since he knows this season is shot in the ass.
by tailgater on
Jul 18, 2007 9:31 AM CDT
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I agree w/ the part this season is shot in the ass
Isn't Ozzie's responsibility to motivate these guys, to help get them out of ruts? If it was a hohum mediocre season, no problem. But we have seen TWO collapses of epic proportions, (Larry's description of hitting woes about 1 month ago) - 1. debacle-like hitting for 2+ months AND 2. the bullpen blowups. Plus, bullshit like Uribe being lazy.
Collapses like these 2 you don't see everyday. Isn't it VERY ODD we've seen BOTH within months of each other on the same team?
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 9:58 AM CDT
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My theory is
However, humans aren't built that way. I've played on championship softball teams where guys were just insane and couldn't wait to pummel opponents. And I've played on some shit teams where the guys can't wait to get to the bar.
Unfortunately, some of the Sox players can't wait to get to the bar. Other than becoming a hard ass and benching slackers, I don't think there's much Ozzie can do about it at this point.
Even when the offense puts up runs, the pitching figures out a way to blow it. When a game is tight they can't hold on...so it's getting frustrating and, to a degree, futile.
by tailgater on
Jul 18, 2007 10:34 AM CDT
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Seriously...
Don't let your 2005 WS feelings block your ability to reason.
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 18, 2007 4:02 PM CDT
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You said the last 2 1/2 years, which is what
It's not personal - it's strictly business, Sonny.
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 5:45 PM CDT
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Ultimately, Uribe has had...
The knock on Uribe was always his laziness and inability to stay in shape. Now it looks like he is going to eat himself out of the league, if he doesn't strike his way out first.
Good riddance.
by SSH2005 on
Jul 18, 2007 5:53 PM CDT
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No it's not personal, but he sucks.
He finished April with a .737 OPS.
Yeah.... FIRRRRRRRRRE! EN FUEGO, BABY!
Pfffft.
You paint Uribe as some hidden hero for the Sox... some behind closed doors savior... someone who is the glue that binds the team together... the lube that greases the wheels and gears... I dunno, I'm running out of comparisons. But seriously, he isn't any of these. He's Adam Everett, only without the speed.
I believe Richar could provide us with better offense than Uribe right now. Defense, well, maybe not, because Richar is reportedly brutal at SS. Find me a league-average SS, sign him for min. salary, and he provides us more than Mr. Profundo.
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 19, 2007 8:05 AM CDT
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Actually...
Even last year, he was well above-average defensively.
He seems to have lost a step or two this year, however. If he's truly regressed to even an average defensive shortstop, he's not worth keeping around.
Like Guillen said, I'd be willing to give him until the end of the season to see if he can turn things around. If not, I'd look for other alternatives. Hopefully the Sox can get someone young and good in trade, because the free agent options this winter look pretty bad.
by The Jerry Royster Experience on
Jul 18, 2007 5:51 PM CDT
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Uribe's OPS and salary with the White Sox...
2005: .712 OPS @ $2,150,000 dollars
2006: .698 OPS @ $3,150,000 dollars
2007: .608 OPS @ $4,150,000 dollars
2008: .??? OPS @ $5,000,000 dollars
If that isn't an obvious trend of decline, I don't know what is. Hawk and D.J. can wait as long as they want for Juanito to get hot, but guess what? It ain't happening. Uribe is definitely not worth $5 million dollars at this point. Good shortstops that can play defense AND also hit are hard to find but Uribe is doing absolutely nothing for us these days. Give Juanito his $300,000 dollar buyout and let him take his !PROFUNDO! somewhere else.
by SSH2005 on
Jul 18, 2007 6:21 PM CDT
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Exactly.
Everyone wants to hop on the "Uribe sucks" bandwagon now because he's booted a few balls, or has lost a step in the field. The fact is with the exception of 2004 and part of 2005, he has been a liability to this team, both financially and offensively.
Missing one play in the field every now and then isn't nearly as bad as going 0-4 with 2K's and 2 popouts every game.
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 19, 2007 7:56 AM CDT
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"defense is overrated".
by ballyb on
Jul 19, 2007 9:10 AM CDT
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Ergo Dal Maxville, Mark Belanger,
Also, in a previous post last week I mentioned that I have become less enamoured of him over the past 2 months after being solidly behimd him in April/May. See, some of us can filter somewhat dispassionately new information and alter our previous assessment based upon that new information. And I have.
So look forward. Dude.
by winningugly on
Jul 19, 2007 9:26 AM CDT
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Not to mention Ozzie Guillen
by ballyb on
Jul 19, 2007 10:15 AM CDT
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I'd love it...
There aren't many shortstops who can both hit and play defense. In fact, as far as the Sox are concerned, there are none. The few that are around aren't going anywhere - they're among the most valuable players in baseball.
There aren't even many shortstops who can hit but can't field. Felipe Lopez was one last year, but his stock has dropped dramatically.
The old saying was, "shake a tree, and a couple of good gloves will fall out". I don't know if that's true any more - there simply aren't very many quality defensive shortstops around. Sure, the Sox could bring in a Royce Clayton type for a year, but ew. What's the point of that?
If the Sox can somehow pry away a good shortstop prospect from someone, that would be terrific. But I'm not optimistic that that will happen. As much as Uribe isn't a good option, I don't see much else out there that would be better.
by The Jerry Royster Experience on
Jul 19, 2007 10:22 AM CDT
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Who would you rather have at SS...
Juan Uribe... or Miguel Tejada?
Juan Uribe... or Nomar Garciaparra before injuries?
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 19, 2007 11:53 AM CDT
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I'd rather...
by The Jerry Royster Experience on
Jul 19, 2007 11:55 AM CDT
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the point is...
I'd rather have any of them over Uribe.
Glaus played SS in college, and is a MUCH better defensive SS than Jermaine Dye ever prays to be. He's fairly underrated defensively at SS. I'd take Glaus and his .250 average and 30 HR's any day over Uribe's garbage.
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 19, 2007 12:08 PM CDT
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I disagree about Glaus...
In any case, these are all pipe dreams. There aren't even any fair-fielding shortstops who can hit like Miguel Tejada even close to available. I don't think many here wouldn't like to see an upgrade on Uribe, but that's easier said than done.
by The Jerry Royster Experience on
Jul 19, 2007 12:12 PM CDT
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Except Glaus would hurt himself
by Sox Machine on
Jul 19, 2007 12:27 PM CDT
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Yes, let us not forget he tried to
I mean, if the point of playing the field is to catch the ball and make an out, and prevent the team from getting on base, then Uribe was simply doing his damn job. He needs to do his damn job at the plate.
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 19, 2007 8:09 AM CDT
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Sox v. Indians/Sep 2005
It's difficult for me to get too down on these guys after '05.
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 10:35 AM CDT
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I was at M, T, W &Th games,
The rest is history.
Although these '07 performances are taxing my "It's difficult for me to get too down on these guys after '05" mindset.
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 10:50 AM CDT
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Stress, lots of stress
This Crede game, one friend of mine was particularly agitated, just living and dying on every pitch from the get go. He told us the night before at this local bar, one bigmouth asshole Cub fan (is there any other kind?) was really riding him, saying the Sox were going to blow the huge lead, they're gaggers, blahblahblah. Whatever, relax homes, it's a baseball game - have another beer.
So the game is just a complete stomach churner the whole night. Bottom of the 10th, three of us are up on the concourse chain smoking, the agitated one is still in our seats. Crede goes deep, every goes crazy, time to go home. But he's still down in his seat, won't move an inch. Finally go down to get him, and he's just staring into space. WTF, game's over - let's go! "Dude, I bet that asshole $5,000 on this game."
Whoa, as if that game wasn't intense enough. I would've shit myself five times that night if I had money riding on it.
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 11:01 AM CDT
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Very good.
This was when no one knew Jenks. Ozzie kept trotting him out and Jenks looked like he was going to have a fucking coronary!
An unbelievable regular season pre ASB, unbelievable post ASB and certainly an unbelievable post season.
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 11:13 AM CDT
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Definitely, Jenks was a total widowmaker
The big guy turned it up to 11 in the playoffs, he was untouchable.
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 11:21 AM CDT
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Except for...
by The Jerry Royster Experience on
Jul 18, 2007 11:43 AM CDT
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Ah yes, I'd forgotten that
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 11:45 AM CDT
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Speaking of the WS
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 11:56 AM CDT
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$5 -- $10 each on EBAY. more or less.
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 12:03 PM CDT
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that's it? figures
I've got my WS Game 2 stub pinned on the bulletin board in my office. Not even the cleaning people bother stealing it.
At least give us a winning team for our troubles.
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 12:09 PM CDT
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Game 1, 2,3 & 4 (the games played)
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 12:13 PM CDT
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vg condition?
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 12:20 PM CDT
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Jizz stains?
Appaently my reaction wasn't quite so intense as yours.
by tailgater on
Jul 18, 2007 12:34 PM CDT
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Mr. Pod go very dip,
by ChicagoPete on
Jul 18, 2007 12:44 PM CDT
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BWAHAHAHAHA
Also, wait until we don't win shit for another 50 years and (if you are still alive) watch the values explode then.
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 12:55 PM CDT
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1st 2 are definitely a negative.
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 12:43 PM CDT
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"We'll open this auction..."
"50 bucks."
"She had nine STD's."
"45 bucks."
"And when we caught her, she wet herself."
"50 bucks."
by Sox Machine on
Jul 18, 2007 12:58 PM CDT
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That's why I was watching it ad nauseum
Even Tank Cabrera in FL can still play a decent 3rd (though SS is a tougher position to do well when you're fat). So WTF? Is it the legal crap? Or $ killing motivation?
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 10:55 AM CDT
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Cheat, where do you find stats like
BTW thanks, great stat!
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 8:04 AM CDT
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Find stats... heck, where do find time
by Brush Back on
Jul 18, 2007 8:06 AM CDT
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Better yet, hjow do you find time
;)
PS I watched that 2005 last out another 30 times before I shut down last night. Never will it get old.
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 8:08 AM CDT
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Do you not have the DVD's?
it's a shame, however, that the only included the clinchers from the ALCS and ALDS. The game with the infamous passed ball and AJ incident isn't on there. Crede's blast against K-Rod isn't there either. It's a shame, I really, really want those series in entirety.
by Shoeless In SC on
Jul 18, 2007 4:04 PM CDT
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NOBODY sleeps!
I need my 8 hours.
by ballyb on
Jul 18, 2007 8:29 AM CDT
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Baseball reference Play index
by The Cheat on
Jul 18, 2007 11:07 AM CDT
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"Hjow" is Finnish for "How"
by winningugly on
Jul 18, 2007 8:09 AM CDT
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Richar
by Joeynach on
Jul 18, 2007 12:52 PM CDT
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