Game 132: White Sox (57-74) @ Rangers (58-72) -- Floyd vs. Gabbard
Gavin Floyd (R, 1-2, 7.36, 10, 4, 33.0, 20, 9, 1.67) vs. Kason Gabbard (L, 2-1, 3.51, 5, 5, 25.2, 16, 8, 1.32) [Throws, W-L, ERA, G, GS, IP, K, BB, WHIP]
Time: 7:35 p.m. CT, TV: CSN+ (CLTV), Radio: WSCR AM-670 (B-R preview, Live Boxscore; 2006 MLB Gameday; 2007 MLB Gameday)
GO SOX!
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Lineups
Name AVG HR RBI SB
1. D Erstad, CF .272 2 27 7
2. J Fields, LF .242 17 50 1
3. J Thome, DH .261 21 66 0
4. P Konerko, 1B .261 26 71 0
5. J Dye, RF .249 26 66 2
6. J Uribe, SS .220 15 52 1
7. D Richar, 2B .211 3 9 1
8. A Gonzalez, 3B .227 2 11 1
9. T Hall, C .216 0 1 0
Bad Guys:
Name AVG HR RBI SB
1. F Catalanotto, LF .267 9 37 2
2. I Kinsler, 2B .255 16 48 16
3. M Young, SS .302 7 68 10
4. M Byrd, CF .306 6 54 2
5. J Botts, DH .228 1 8 1
6. B Wilkerson, 1B .235 18 54 2
7. N Cruz, RF .222 6 24 1
8. G Laird, C .225 7 40 5
9. T Metcalf, 3B .248 2 14 0
GO SOX!
I just started watching and man am I bored
by omnipotent grab on Aug 28, 2007 7:41 PM CDT reply actions
Oi this is terrible
by omnipotent grab on Aug 28, 2007 7:47 PM CDT reply actions
Bored?
Damn. Floyd is pitching in a few minutes. Get ready to hold onto your hat. Or nut-sack.
I think
Floyd! Floyd! Floyd!
Frank Sinatra "A Man Alone"
Love, the White Sox Marketing Department
Sigh
Held by the habit of being on his own
A man who listens to the trembling of the trees
With sentimental ease
In me, you see a man alone
Behind the wall he's learned to call his home
A man who still goes walkin' in the rain
Expecting love again
A man not lonely except when the dark comes on
A man learning to live with mem'ries of midnights that fell apart at dawn
In me, you see a man alone
Drinking up Sundays and spending them alone
A man who knows love is seldom what it seems
Only other people's dreams
[instrumental-strings]
A man learning to live with memories of midnights that fell apart at dawn
In me, you see a man alone
Drinking up Sundays and spending them alone
A man who knows love is seldom what it seems
Just other people's dreams
'night
Try not to turn on to
Problems that upset you
Well, don't you know
Everything's all right
Yes, Everything's fine
And I think I shall sleep well tonight
Let the world turn without me tonight
Close your eyes
Close your eyes
And forget all about us tonight
Lastly
Peter? John? James?
Will none of you wait with me?
Peter? John? James?
OK, that's it. Really. I'm sounding like colin. I'm going to wake the wife.
I lied!
I'm back in the saddle again
I'm back
I'm back in the saddle again
Damon 2-run HR puts Spanks in the lead.
Delicious.
Woot Thomer!!
by omnipotent grab on Aug 28, 2007 8:26 PM CDT reply actions
Nah more like Pods
by omnipotent grab on Aug 28, 2007 8:44 PM CDT up reply actions
floyd is so tantalizing
It really pisses me off...
by southsider80 on Aug 28, 2007 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions
You figure once through
i'm not sure
That's generally true
Really, though, his status as a number 1 starter submarined his chances, ironically. I think he's got a really straight fastball because of his arm slot and I'm betting no one was willing to mess with that due to his status. Halladay went through a similar change which was cited for his success thereafter. Obviously, I'm no Don Cooper, but I think that's where I'd start. If you can't pitch off your fastball, you're going to give up runs. His fastball is reaaaallly hittable. I'd love to see his pitch f/x data (swings and misses, etc.) for that pitch relative to an average fastball.
i'm not sure i'm pissed off
Don't get me wrong...
by southsider80 on Aug 28, 2007 9:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Are teams afraid of Fields in left
you are just looking too hard
by omnipotent grab on Aug 28, 2007 8:54 PM CDT up reply actions
The Bronx is Burning series finale
by omnipotent grab on Aug 28, 2007 9:01 PM CDT reply actions
IS Toby Hall the biggest waste
I still have the bad after taste of that era
by omnipotent grab on Aug 28, 2007 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions
Sad - we had such high hopes
Late to the game
by Florida Jim on Aug 28, 2007 10:03 PM CDT reply actions
jinx
by Florida Jim on Aug 28, 2007 10:05 PM CDT reply actions
When's Cintron coming back?!?!
Hawk really spinning the dial
lol
Peabody's Improbable History
Don't worry
AGonz
Fat Toby
Erstad
by ChicagoPete on Aug 28, 2007 10:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Who said they can't bunt?
*just
Wake up!
by ChicagoPete on Aug 28, 2007 10:29 PM CDT up reply actions
Ok, go back to sleep
by ChicagoPete on Aug 28, 2007 10:30 PM CDT up reply actions
No, wait wait!
by ChicagoPete on Aug 28, 2007 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions
i'm more interested in the head to head
I'm sure this has been noted......
to quote
Now where did I put those rose colored glasses?
I'll feel much better if we start hearing more of this from management. Wouldn't it be nice if they came out this winter and said ok, we SUCK - first order of business is getting all this garbage (Cintron, Ozuna, Owens, Erstad, MacDougal, etc) off of the roster. Doesn't matter if we have to eat their contracts or not.
Love it.
With ya.
Get some guys
I don't care if we lose as long as we play FUNDAMENTALLY good baseball.
I'm sure Ozzie will be backpeddling this statement
Were is that statement from - can you post the link.
Where is that from?
by Shoeless In SC on Aug 29, 2007 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions
Link
Gavin Fraud. Nice touch Cowley.
by Shoeless In SC on Aug 29, 2007 8:57 AM CDT up reply actions
Horseshit is the operative word
Kenny's dumpster diving is coming back to haunt us, because what's happened to this team is that we've managed to stockpile an amazing amount of really bad players signed to really bad contracts. He's gotten lucky on occasion turning a sow's ear into a silk purse, but this season all we're left with is a bunch of sow's ears.
Now Ozzie is trying to distance himself from this mess, but he's partly to blame himself. He's asked KW to go out and get him players in his own image, and the chickens have come home to roost.
"players in his own image"
It's not easy to find major leaguers with those numbers, bad fundamentals and weak arms.
A trifecta of sorts.
Some really bad 2008 contracts
Alex Cintron (-10.3) $1mm
Joe Crede (-10.3) ~$5mm
Juan Uribe (-11.6) $5mm
Pablo Ozuna (-3.6) $1mm
Mike MacDougal (-2.8) $2mm
Jose Contreras (-14.6) $10mm
That's about $25mm for negative VORP. You've got to have some junk on your roster like a Terrero or AGonz, but at least those guys make minimum salary. The guys above are what kill you, their combined $24mm can get you 2 or 3 good ballplayers on the FA market.
Please KW, do NOT pick up the options on Crede and Uribe. And what the hell were you thinking pulling Pods off of the waiver wire when you could have dumped him on the Cubs? That's $1mm we could have gotten rid of.
by ChicagoPete on Aug 29, 2007 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions
How could I forget Fat Toby?
by ChicagoPete on Aug 29, 2007 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions
Hindsight...
As for Crede, again I think it was reasonable to bring him back for 2007. Obviously, it would have been better to move him but who knows what the market for Crede was like. We'll see if he returns for 2008. Same with Uribe.
Most of the guys on list weren't obviously a waste of money till their performance this season. Ozuna and Contreras are the two contracts that I think are really open for criticism.
The hidden, bigger problem here is minor league system. If KW is forced to bring back Uribe or similarly overpay some other underperforming vet it will be because the minors offer no viable alternative. And that's all on Williams.
by hitlesswonder on Aug 29, 2007 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm in agreement here.
I seem to recall that people were thinking that MacDougal, Jenks, and Thornton were going to be the backbone of the 'pen. Nobody was complaining about that contract at the time it was signed.
I also agree about the minor leagues. They're completely bereft of talent, which is a big reason why the team is in this mess. They had absolutely no room for error this season - key players got hurt and underperformed, so the team was screwed. They had no backup plan.
by The Jerry Royster Experience on Aug 29, 2007 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions
"They had no backup plan."
What could Plan B have been?
What I meant was...
by The Jerry Royster Experience on Aug 29, 2007 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm not talking about hindsight
We can save $10mm by not picking up Uribe's option and not offering Crede arb. It would also be great if we could get off the hook for Contreras' contract.
I know some people want Crede back, but I think it's a big mistake that ripples through the pond. Odds are he gets hurt again so you just pissed away another $5mm. On top of that by bringing him back you put Fields in LF to start the season, so when Fields moves back to 3B you end up just putting another negative VORP guy (Jesse?) back out in LF. If you don't sign Crede then KW has to go out and get a real LF.
That's the same kind of mess we had this year when Pods, Erstad & Crede went down. They were all injury-prone, and we had no contingency plan other than to stick a bunch of crap out there.
by ChicagoPete on Aug 29, 2007 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree...
by The Jerry Royster Experience on Aug 29, 2007 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Or Richar
At this point in the season its truly time to be creative and see what talent we have. Lou's been doing it on the north side since the start of the season. Not to mention in that division they're in a race and he still trying to find the correct niche for his resources.
It's my understanding...
by The Jerry Royster Experience on Aug 29, 2007 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
I've heard that
seeing him play second
and moving iguchi? that move would have been made whether we had a danny richar or not.
On Richar
Good thing Wizzer didn't see it - he'd have Danny out in center... hmmm - Gooch back at 2, Gonzo at SS (nah)
that article points to footwork
Hasn't Reyes been working on his footwork?
by winningugly on Aug 29, 2007 12:17 PM CDT up reply actions
sure
Yeah,
Sorry.
Danny at SS has been suggested
Let's take an effin' meat-axe to this club this year, already. Delicate surgery isn't warranted -Mafia-style cleaving is needed. "You need this every 5-10 years - it gets rid of the bad blood."
by winningugly on Aug 29, 2007 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions
I could live with that.
Trade Vazquez AND Garland. Move Konerko. See if Thome will waive his no-trade. Non-tender Podsednik and Crede. Get rid of as many people who are over 30 as possible. Bring in prospects, somebody who will convince me that this team won't be a bottomless hole of suck for the next decade.
But that's not what's going to happen. Williams will try and duct-tape the team together, maybe bring in a recognizable name or two and try and trick the fans into thinking the team can contend in '08.
by The Jerry Royster Experience on Aug 29, 2007 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions
I miss Terrero
by omnipotent grab on Aug 29, 2007 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions
VORP
by Florida Jim on Aug 29, 2007 11:26 AM CDT up reply actions
VORP = Value Over Replacement Player
VORP
The key is "Replacement Player"
A replacement player is a hypothetical player that you can bring up from AAA for minimum salary, or that you can grab off the waiver wires (think Mike Myers or Craig Monroe) for minimum salary. You aggregate the statistics for these bottom of the barrel guys, and this gives you a benchmark for expected production by position (ie, the bar will be higher for a LF than for a SS).
Value Over Replacement Player just means how good (or in Sox case, how bad) a player is when measured against this hypothetical piece of garbage floating around that you can pick up for a song or promote from AAA. A good example is Matt Murton, right now he is exactly at zero VORP, so there's a good reason why he's been spending the whole season bouncing up and down between Iowa and the Cubs.
This differs significantly from benchmarking against an "Average" player. An average player is really valuable, and usually a lot more expensive.
A replacement player isn't necessarily horrible if you're paying him minimum salary. Unless you're the Yankees, you need cheap guys to fill out the roster. But when you have a lineup filled with guys who can't even post a zero VORP you've got horseshit.
Go to "audit teams" and play with this, pretty interesting. A lot of guys get by just on good reputations or lucky contracts:
http://bbp.cx/team_audit.php?stats&team=CHA
by ChicagoPete on Aug 29, 2007 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Does Gustavo Molina
If so, then indeed, that bar is low.
He's the poster child for negative VORP
by ChicagoPete on Aug 29, 2007 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions
VORP
Tough season for us Sox fans.
by Florida Jim on Aug 30, 2007 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, here's another great quote:
That's what Jay Jaffe said about our team in a recent column on BP. The sad thing is, it isn't our replacements who are just now getting over the negative VORP hump. We are going to be one of the worst offenses in the 00's.
No kidding
I think KW is looking at his stats chart upside down.
by ChicagoPete on Aug 29, 2007 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions
What I really want to know is
Look at the link
Actually, "horseshit" is one of my old-time baseball descriptive terms. About effin' time he used it to describe the team (though not management's performance - that would be too close to home).
Re: pre-season contracts - how about Pods/Erstad along with Count/Ozuna? And not all of us were enamored of Toby Chong - look it up. And Cheat and others questioned the whole Crede experience. So I don't think many of us throught we were set in the 'pen, the OF, 3B, or SS.
by winningugly on Aug 29, 2007 11:19 AM CDT up reply actions
"Said", goddammit
by winningugly on Aug 29, 2007 11:21 AM CDT up reply actions
What got me going was that TB game
Then when you really dig through the numbers you see why we're so fucking bad.
by ChicagoPete on Aug 29, 2007 11:34 AM CDT up reply actions
Yeah, it hit me looking at the 2 lineups
We, on the other hand, are only dangerous to my health. I think I'm going to have a coronary if I keep watching this season.
by winningugly on Aug 29, 2007 11:39 AM CDT up reply actions
And after yesterday
Having the draft choice won't do us any good anyways - Boras usually wraps up the top talent and we will get some 2 sport guy that just started baseball his sophomore year in college. But he's over 6'3" and can throw over 95mph95mph
Hey, is this Jimmy Two Times?
:0
by winningugly on Aug 29, 2007 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions
Are you Lance Briggs?
by winningugly on Aug 29, 2007 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions

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