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Two Shortstops Pass in the Night

"White Sox fans are really gonna take to this guy."

That was Kenny Williams (roughly, from memory) during the spring of '04 sitting in with Hawk and DJ in the TV booth of a spring training game. The player to whom he was referring was Juan Uribe.

"As long as he stays back," Williams referring to Uribe's swing-at-everything approach, "he's gonna open some eyes." Just as KW finished that thought, Uribe sent a tape measure shot over the left-center field wall in Tucson Electric Park.

That's how White Sox fans were introduced to Juan Uribe. Expected by most only to be a platoon/utility guy, Uribe got off to a hot start and quickly cemented himself into a regular rotation in the Sox middle infield. By season's end with Uribe posting a .830 OPS and demonstrating plus defense at 3 defensive positions, it was clear that Uribe was the Sox shortstop of the future.

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"Every time we play this kid at any position, he goes out there and looks better than what we thought."

That was Ozzie Guillen during spring of '08, impressed by Alexei Ramirez' ability to adapt quickly to each new situation he was handed.

Ramirez was the story of the '08 spring training. Can he play second? What about CF and SS? Can we get him enough at-bats? But unlike Uribe, he did not get off to a hot start. After starting the first two games of the season, a seemingly over-matched Ramirez was benched in favor of soon-to-be MVP candidate Carlos Quentin. But when opportunity knocked in the form of a Juan Uribe injury, Ramirez was ready, posting a .304/.331/.502 line over the rest of the season as he Wally Pipped Uribe.

It's now Ramirez who appears to be the White Sox' shortstop of the (immediate) future.

I make this comparison because it illustrates how quickly we can go from having our "shortstop of the future" to looking for the next one (I was going to post some pitch-type data from Uribe and Ramirez' first seasons on the south side here, but Ramirez' data disappeared from baseball-reference) and lends me to the question...

What becomes of Juan Uribe?

Uribe is a free agent this off-season, but has stated his desire to stay with the White Sox if all possible. He would seem to represent the Sox fall-back option, a safety net for Chris Getz and Josh Fields, if they're unable to upgrade their starters at 2nd or 3rd base.

Today's signing of Jayson Nix, who's far from someone who should be counted on even in a backup role, gives the Sox a bit more flexibility with their middle infield situation. Though I doubt anyone would be comfortable heading into the season with and infield comprised of Ramirez, Getz and Fields with only Nix around to provide backup. The Nix signing, along with all the praise that Chris Getz has received since September, should give some insight into the Sox intentions at second base. I doubt they'll be looking to add much there either through free agency or the trade market.

Uribe's return to the Sox would seem to be at least partially contingent on their plan at third base, and more importantly, on his willingness to accept a pay cut for the second straight season.

* * * * *

The Mariners fired scouting director Bob Fontaine, who previously held the title of Director of Player Personnel with the White Sox from '01 to '03. Given the recent turnover in the Sox' scouting department (thanks Dave!), his previous relationship with the Sox and Kenny Williams, and his respect throughout the industry, he would be a nice pickup for the Sox front office.

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Comments

Display:

Thank God.

There was always a small chance. Still is, I guess, until we see the press release that he signed elsewhere

Pitching and defense win baseball games in September and October.

by ballyb on Oct 29, 2008 9:23 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This post almost made me cry.

Oh, how I’ll miss you Juan. Even I don’t get to miss you in ‘09, I’ll miss you eventually.

by mjthor on Oct 29, 2008 2:19 AM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thanks for the continued good and creative content, Cheat.

As Churchill said, “These are the times that try men’s souls”. I believe he was discussing rain-outs during the World Series with NOTHING else going on.

Whoosh!

by winningugly on Oct 29, 2008 8:14 AM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"winning tacos for America was pretty cool too."

by larry on Oct 29, 2008 1:39 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL.

I mean, I really laughed because no one seemed to care. Ah, you can lead them to water…

Whoosh!

by winningugly on Oct 29, 2008 7:00 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The movement was so devastating that television announcer Hawk Harrelson called it "the Doomerang," saying that if Day had enough distance to work with, the pitch would eventually come back to him.

by U-God on Oct 29, 2008 2:39 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

boers and bernstein

anyone else listening in on what terry is saying about dye and the angels right now?

by lod773 on Oct 29, 2008 2:29 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

saying he has a source

Kenny knows what he has to do, however is a bit down about not having the resources to operate. Saying the sox WILL talk to Garland. .

A couple of teams have inquired on dye
People around the league really think the sox are done with vazquez after the end of the year, and he doesnt have a whole lot of value to them now.
(Not that hes not valueable, just his value to the sox is at an all time low)

by lod773 on Oct 29, 2008 2:46 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Mostly Guesses

but its fun hearing how this team may be shaped in the future

by lod773 on Oct 29, 2008 2:48 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

didn't hear the part about dye,

just turned it on when they were talking about poreda

by El Duque's Raft on Oct 29, 2008 2:45 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yeah, saying hes their only chip

by lod773 on Oct 29, 2008 2:47 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

have a listen

click listen now in the upper right hand corner

http://www.670thescore.com/

by lod773 on Oct 29, 2008 2:42 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If we are rumor-mongering, Levine on 1000 said

The Sox would like to deal Dye, but they can’t get the value they want for him.

Swisher and Vazquez are the Sox main trading chips at the major league level and are likely gone.

by hitlesswonder on Oct 29, 2008 3:02 PM CDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Swisher

I cant understand why you would sell low on him, unless you thought he was absolutely DONE.

by lod773 on Oct 29, 2008 3:09 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed.

Javy sort of falls into that category as well….besides, we need Vasquez, despite how aggravating he was down the stretch. We need to add a starter, not subtract one.

by dantesox on Oct 29, 2008 3:14 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

this from the guy who said konerko would definitely be traded last offseason.

thanks for playing, bruce.

"winning tacos for America was pretty cool too."

by larry on Oct 29, 2008 3:12 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Things change.

Pitching and defense win baseball games in September and October.

by ballyb on Oct 29, 2008 3:15 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yeah.

they also usually don’t start until the white sox have had their organizational meetings.

"winning tacos for America was pretty cool too."

by larry on Oct 29, 2008 3:16 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

right

I wouldn’t put too much stock into what Levine has to say. Seems like his ‘sources’ are more often than not, wrong.

by El Duque's Raft on Oct 29, 2008 3:22 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

he seems to have good sources regarding re-signings and contract negotiations.

trades, not so much. you can probably discern from that who his source(s) generally are – rich hahns guys, not KWs.

"winning tacos for America was pretty cool too."

by larry on Oct 29, 2008 3:26 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah...I have no idea what the Sox will do aside from calling about Figgins

Saying JV and Swish are the trade chips is plausible in that both sucked and had “attitude issues” — so you could easily imagine a pissed-off KW wanting to move them. But at the same time Swisher is a good bet to rebound and, as bad as JV was, moving him to open up a spot for Broadway isn’t full of win. So, I’m not convinced they are so gone….

by hitlesswonder on Oct 29, 2008 3:52 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Good point.

KW has outfoxed everyone on this site in the 3 years I’ve been watching from the SSS perch. And you guys are pretty smart.

(Chuckles.)

Whoosh!

by winningugly on Oct 29, 2008 7:01 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

When it comes to KW, the thing you expect him to do is never done

and the thing you least expect is priority #1. Of course, I really wanted Alexei to be signed, and was thrilled when he was signed so cheaply, but that’s about it.

I see it this way: Javy has a NTC to the whole west, so that’s 21 teams he can be traded to. He won’t be traded to DET, MIN, or CLE, so that’s 18. KC is rather cheap, but maybe a David DeJesus trade could work(lol pipedream). In reality, that’s 17. The Yankees won’t trade for him again, 16. The Rays don’t need him, 15. Red Sox? Maybe, for Crisp and/or Lugo. So there’s one. Blue Jays might need him, as candidates coming back I can think of Rolen(ntc), Aaron Hill, B.J. Ryan and (ahem) Alexis Rios

(*flinches*)

if the Sox throw in something to even it out, but that would be Buehrle more likely. I think I remember Buehrle-Rios being brought up a few years ago. Orioles might trade one of their vets, like Melvin Mora, which probably wouldn’t be that great a tradeoff from our perspective. Of the NL, the Cubs don’t need him, 14. The Cards might, but that’s an iffy match-up. The Stros might, but again that’s iffy. Reds doesn’t work, Pirates are a no, Brewers… ech, maybe. LOL Nationals, Marlins are paid about as much as Vazquez, and the Braves haven’t the payroll or ML talent. Phillies and Mets go into the maybes. And last but not least, he cannot be traded to the White Sox. So of the 8 teams he would feasibly be traded to, none of them match-up so well and it might just be best to keep Javy.

And Swish needs to be kept for another season at least. Too much history and youth working for him.

by Daniel Berlyn on Oct 29, 2008 7:24 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How many guys are there?

I thought rich was KW’s guy on everything – who are his guys?

by VictorB on Oct 29, 2008 4:50 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"i'm convinced the whole day long that all i learn is always wrong."

by Toonderstrook on Oct 29, 2008 5:02 PM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think the guy

in the middle recommended claiming Jenks off waivers.

by VictorB on Oct 30, 2008 10:24 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   1 recs

rec'd

"i helped move the body because that mafia motherfucker was gonna beat the shit outta me."

by Toonderstrook on Oct 30, 2008 11:06 AM CDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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