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Thanks for the Memory, Junior

After saying goodbye to Orlando Cabrera, it seemed oddly appropriate to do the same, in abbreviated fashion, for the White Sox other high-profile hired gun, Ken Griffey Jr. After all, Junior was only around for a little over two months. Proportionally, he should get about one-third the coverage of Cabrera.

610x_medium

We were never fully on board with the Griffey acquisition, and saw Junior in a White Sox uniform was nothing more than a novelty. With any luck, Griffey might have been invigorated by his first playoff race since he left the AL. But the Sox were not so lucky. They got 35 games worth of singles-turned-triples in center field and 145 at-bats of Tony Graffanino at the plate. Not exactly the boost they were looking for. Though in the Sox defense, the only thing separating them from the Griffey of old was a time machine. So, they were close.

Who will ever forget those two singles in his first game wearing black? Or that time when he provided all of the Sox runs in that shellacking at the hands of the Twins? Or when he provided all the runs in that closer game against the Twins the next day? The memories will last a lifetime.

So, thank you, Junior. You're time in Chicago will never be forgotten.

Oh, and Brian Anderson would have caught that.

What are you reading?

Bloglines was a little bitch today, and I found myself way too far behind on my Perez Hilton reading. (I didn't even know Jamie Lynn was pregnant again until just a few minutes ago!) It's the second time in about a couple of weeks that Bloglines has spit the bit for an extended period of time, so I'm officially making the switch to Google Reader. I imported all my feeds to the Google back when they introduced Reader--which at the time was too slow for my liking--so a good bit of those feeds are now dead.

I'm taking this opportunity to prune my current list of feeds and solicit your advice for some new feeds. So what feeds, besides this one, obviously, are daily reads for you? Baseball, sports, humor, music, whatever. I don't care. If it's worth reading, let me know. Let your fellow SSSer know.

Oh and for WinningUgly--because I know the question is coming--RSS is explained here, and here, and here.

0 recs  |  Comment 196 comments |

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Comments

Display:

cheat is a stone cold killer.

calling out wu’s lack of internetz knowledge is one thing, but then slipping in the wu-like misspelling is just ice cold.

"well, i'm sure i'd feel much worse if i weren't under such heavy sedation."

by Toonderstrook on Oct 9, 2008 12:20 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

i can't believe he said he wants to play a few more years.

know when to hang it up, old man. you’ve got nothing left in the tank. please retire before you permanently taint all of our memories of you with this shell of your former self.

You're on thin fucking ice my pedigree chums, and I shall be under it when it breaks. Now, fuck off.

by MarketMaker on Oct 9, 2008 12:20 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

he's been a shell of his former self since like 2002

this is the shell of his shell of his former self.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 8:30 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

and think

if he plays three more years he could become the shell of his shell of his shell of his former self

"Deserve's got nothin to do with it."

by U-God on Oct 9, 2008 8:56 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

so if griffey's option

officially not been picked up or what?

by Jbasic89 on Oct 9, 2008 12:35 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Nothing is official. but what else am I gonna write?

Hawk thinks the Sox were the best team out there. They just needed to be more consistently healthy?

“We just got beat by a better team,” Harrelson said. "If you want to give us [injured] Joe Crede and Carlos Quentin and Jose Contreras, we’re as good as anybody. I’m proud of our club.

“The three best teams I saw all year were all eliminated in the first round—the Angels, the Cubs and us, when we had Quentin and Crede and Contreras healthy. Quentin was probably going to be MVP, and then we lose him. It was one of those years when they just never quit.”

AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on Oct 9, 2008 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

iseewhatyoudidthere. now i'm going to look even crazier than normal.

"well, i'm sure i'd feel much worse if i weren't under such heavy sedation."

by Toonderstrook on Oct 9, 2008 12:47 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

just start making threads about what the sox should do this offseason.

and continue to make one every single day leading up to the winter meetings to see if kenny can pull off an under the radar move that no one knew about… ya digg?

by Jbasic89 on Oct 9, 2008 1:40 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

the 2 best teams i saw all year are facing each other in the ALCS.

You're on thin fucking ice my pedigree chums, and I shall be under it when it breaks. Now, fuck off.

by MarketMaker on Oct 9, 2008 1:44 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think the Cubs might have been the best.

P-R-E-S-S-U-R-E.

Pitching and defense win baseball games in September and October.

by ballyb on Oct 9, 2008 6:38 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

"Deserve's got nothin to do with it."

by U-God on Oct 9, 2008 8:58 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

not sure about that.

at least if we’re talking over a full season. the cubs had a lot of troubles late in the year, especially in their pitching. it wasn’t a great surprise, at least to me, that they got handled by the dodgers in summary fashion. people piss on the dodgers a lot because they played out west and didn’t have a great overall record but they’re a different team with a shorter rotation and manny and furcal in the lineup.

when the cubs were playing real well early in the season, they were probably the best team i saw all year. but i think i agree that the best clubs over the full season were the red sox and rays, especially considering what competiton they had to face.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

endadget is decent if you are a tech nerd

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 8:31 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

*engadget, sorry, its early

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 8:31 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Graffanino...hahahahahahaahahahahahaahahahahahahaha

hey! he helped us win the World Series.

albeit, he was not playing for us at the time….but he helped!

who knows…maybe griff will be on another team next year, and help the sox rack up some triples….he may be of service to us yet!

...and then some depressed fucked-cake eating.

by homesickalien on Oct 9, 2008 8:33 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

my g-reader has the following atm

Sox Machine
mgoblog
blog a bull
SSS (duh)
the blog that Yost built (michigan hockey blog)
Every Day Should Be Saturday (college football)
Palehose 8
Life in the Cell
Ronald Bellamy’s Underachieving All Stars (michigan sports essays)
Five Thirty Eight

apparently i don’t read many non-sports blogs.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 8:34 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

How do you feel about EDSBS

I think Orson is a pretty good writer, but a lot of the other stuff on that site is trash. Particularly the commenters.

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

maybe not trash

but not as good as some of the stuff Orson has written. I thought his piece on UF v. UT was really good – just don’t see a lot of stuff up to that standard is what I meant.

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's why I don't read the EDSBS comments

Between Orson’s stuff and the LSUfreek .gifs, that site is a daily read for me.

Their greatest post of all time still is “Intercourse Hero” although the one on Limas Sweed before the draft was pretty awesome as well.

Chicago White Sox Examiner — Your what hurts?

by UribeAuction on Oct 9, 2008 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah and their inside jokes suck

ours are way cooler

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Orson is a killer writer

and it’s his site, so it pretty much rulz.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah i'm not especially diverse

but honestly, my other interests aren’t nearly as satisfied by the quality of writing out there. i have yet to find a music blog that writes at all interestingly or insightfully. politics is a shithole and everything about it makes me cringe. and…i dn. what else is there as far as blogs go?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it was the sort of acquisition

that made you realize that the general bloodymindedness of the universe will never be allayed.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 8:35 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

A feed I really like

The Boston Globe’s “Big Picture” feed.

About once or twice a week they will have a ton of high quality photos of random, but always interesting stuff.

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/

It was a good season.

by vince_ on Oct 9, 2008 8:36 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Additionally, a good football feed

Creates graphs and rankings of the NFL based solely on win-loss record.

http://beatpaths.com/

It was a good season.

by vince_ on Oct 9, 2008 8:40 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Daily reads

Great year Cheat – your year-end summary was dead-on.

I read www.aintitcool.com pretty much every day.
For fantasy sports, I go to www.fantasysportscentral.com

Look forward to a fun offseason, where I am not a casual observer!

by P-Hose08 on Oct 9, 2008 9:29 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

FLAGGED!

www.huffingtonpost.com

"well, i'm sure i'd feel much worse if i weren't under such heavy sedation."

by Toonderstrook on Oct 9, 2008 9:44 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Thanks for the props, Cheat.

Old and slow. Thank you for pointing it out. I appreciate all the patience everyone shows on this site.

www.yahoofinance.com. Fair and balanced. www.minyanville.com works, too.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 10:16 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

does your wife approve of your sig on a day like this?

"well, i'm sure i'd feel much worse if i weren't under such heavy sedation."

by Toonderstrook on Oct 9, 2008 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

STFU. Too clever for your own good.

By the way, yes, she’s fine with it. The service today had a place where we (and the whole congragation) looked at each other and actually said “I’m sorry” and “I forgive you”. Quite powerful. I’d love to see that forum on SSS.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

hmm...congragation

must. not. pile. on.

oops, too late.

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

congregation.

You’d think hangin with the Yids today I’d be more vigilant in my typing.

You’d be wrong.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, I've certainly been wrong before

and whether you apologize or not, I still forgive you.

What’s the significance of today again?

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yom Kippur, Day of Atonement.

Apologize, ask for forgiveness. Go out and do the same stuff. Next year apologize, ask for forgiveness. Like MM after a night with his hookers and blow.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

who asks for forgiveness after a night with hookers and blow?

it should be a day of thanks!

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh, and thanks for the explanation

damn gentile upbringing.

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:09 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I suggest watching "Annie Hall" for more education.

Funny stuff. And you’re old enough to appreciate Woody Allen.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

How do you know I'm old enough?

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just know.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 6:20 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well then, we're even.

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 7:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

since i know no one actually reads my minor league fanpost without prompting

go to it to get the link to gordon beckham’s AFL blog; first entry up today.

http://www.southsidesox.com/2008/10/8/630896/season-over-officially-tim

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 10:59 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

not so.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 11:41 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

whaaaaaaa

...and then some depressed fucked-cake eating.

by homesickalien on Oct 9, 2008 11:51 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't even read it when you do prompt us

or do I?

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Football Outsiders

Henry Abbott’s True Hoop page on ESPN

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 11:23 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

i don't read FO regularly

because i could give two shits about the NFL, but they are very very good.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I only read Bears related content

I really don’t care for the league outside of the Bears.

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

they've got some college football content now

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah the guy at Rock M Nation

got called up to the big leagues. his stuff should be pretty good, but he’s not there yet. i’ve emailed back and forth and right now he’s laying out his ideas and trying to get the data on line so he can really start working with it and get it out to the public.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Boy is an awesome guy

He offers me free food at tailgates.

His BTBS stuff is insane, though. I don’t know how a guy with a job and wife has the time to put that all together, but he’s able to do it.

Chicago White Sox Examiner — Your what hurts?

by UribeAuction on Oct 9, 2008 12:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it's the stuff that i would do if i had the expertise

producing an actual data set with value to thousands of college sports fans? that’s pretty awesome. josh kalk is doing the same thing. i’m very jealous.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

sweet jebus i know nothing about the market and economics

well maybe not nothing. but i sure as shit don’t have an opinion on it. someone want to explain the crisis and who’s at fault and all that? if you find yourself writing too much, maybe start a fanpost to keep a shitstorm out of the mainpage thread?

/apropos of nothing

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 11:44 AM CDT reply actions   0 recs

in short?

just about everyone. the government for providing the conditions for easy credit, the financial institutions for providing the easy credit, and the consumers for availaing themselves of the easy credit. plenty of blame to go around.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

is it a consumer's fault for taking what was offered him?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

of course.

absent fraud, misrepresentation or other misconduct, why wouldn’t it be.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 12:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it's less the rate

than the misguided belief that home prices would always go up and up and thus they’d be able to refinance out of it (or some other avenue). such a belief is and was foolish.

and it’s not just home loans that are the issue. credit card, car loans, etc. people in america have been living beyond their means for too long. the comeupppance is now.

it’s going to get worse, by the way.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don’t want my beer to taste like fruit or honey. I want pussy to taste that way.

by thatshortkid on Oct 9, 2008 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I can't see!

FIAL, by one of us, but depends on perspective.

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I forget the guys name and I'm too lazy to look it up right now

But the NYT’s mag profiled the economist who saw this whole thing coming and was basically outcast as a cassandra by his peers. Well now he looks like a prophet, although some critics are saying even a broken clock is right twice a day.

FWIW, he said things were going to continue to get worse and that this is just the beginning of a long downward trend.

I’m not really blaming consumers for this mess, they are not monetary or financial policy experts, they saw an opportunity to get a mortgage and took it. The banks should have known better — they are supposed to be the adults here.

It’s terribly sad what happened with the families of foreclosed homes that are now probably for the rest of their lives locked into renting — with no chance to acquire the home ownership that marks most of this country’s middle class wealth and assets.

But let’s not overstate things. The unemployment rate is still only about 5. This is a far cry from the 25 during the great depression.

What’s stupid are people saying that the US economic model has failed and that now China will take over. What happens (like it has in every industrialized society) when China’s massive rural and urban poor organize and form unions? We’ll see if China can continue to export dirt cheap goods as the basis of their economy then.

I’m very pessimistic about things right now. I really think that the standard of living for many Americans has probably peaked. Cheap oil energy is over, the American century (borne of post WWII dominance) is over. Perhaps technology will provide solutions to improve the quality of life, but I am not certain.
  
I am just incredibly thankful that my parents provided me an opportunity to get an education and that I now have a relatively secure job that isn’t directly affected by downturns. I’m glad that outside of student loans I have no dept, I’m also glad those loans are locked in at 5%.

by madvillian on Oct 9, 2008 12:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well, i would take issue with consumers not being "adults", as well.

i don’t particularly subscribe to a paternalistic notion of government or business and that’s historically been the way things are in the united states. i realize this is a matter of debate everywhere and our more individualistic society does cause problems (see, e.g., now). but the alternative doesn’t strike me as particularly appealing, either.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It works both ways.

The banks shouldn’t have been lending the money, the borrowers shouldn’t have gotten themselves into mortgages they couldn’t afford to pay.

My wife and I lived in San Francisco during the peak of the housing boom. There were fixer-uppers in San Francisco going for close to seven figures, and you’d pay $400K for a house in the worst gang-infested neighborhood in Oakland. It was insane. We were both relatively successful, professional people, and we knew that we wouldn’t be able to afford the minimum three to four thousand dollar mortgage payment it would take to be a homeowner in the area. So we kept renting, despite all our friends telling us we were “wasting our money”.

But a lot of people got themselves into gray areas financially to get themselves into a home, thinking that the value of the home would always go up. That was a choice that they made, and I don’t feel bad now that they’re suffering the consequences of that choice.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Oct 9, 2008 12:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The whole thing makes me slightly relieved

Seeing all these huge houses being built in the SW suburbs made me wonder if I was poorer than I thought. Instead, it turns out I’m relatively smart.

On the flipside, I probably won’t be moving out of NY anytime soon. A couple years ago, a couple friends bought their own 3-BR houses in good neighborhoods for $100-120K, which people back home have a hard time fathoming.

Chip, chip, chip, chip.
Sox Machine

by Sox Machine on Oct 9, 2008 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

In New York?

I’m assuming this is upstate somewhere?

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Oct 9, 2008 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yup. Capital region.

Because a lot of the jobs here are state jobs, we’re relatively insulated from impacts of booms and busts. Housing prices didn’t go up that much (outside of new developments in the northern suburbs, so they’re taking their time coming down.

Chip, chip, chip, chip.
Sox Machine

by Sox Machine on Oct 9, 2008 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it's kind of a cultural thing.

and it needs to be eradicated in this country and hopefully this crisis will do it. people in europe and other places around the world do not take on the same risks with credit that americans do (i think you can apply this to both consumers and the financial institutions, though i’m speaking specifically about consumers). people made dumb choices. the fact that other people make the same dumb choices isn’t exactly a defense worth making. just like saying i’m too dumb to have known the potential consequences of my actions isn’t exactly a defense, either.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

In Europe the risks aren't taken as much

because european country’s have much stricter regulations on lending than the US, were of course most regulations have much more slack.

This financial mess is only the first shoe to fall.

Health care costs, insurance costs for everything, energy costs, food costs – they all are going to be major obstacles.

The world as us Americans knew it, at least since the Reagan years is most definetly over.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i'm not sure that's necessarily true re: europe.

if you want to run up credit card debt in a lot of european countries (obviously generalizing a bit considering the number of countries) you certainly can run yourself up to the hilt. we can also talk about the difference in savings rate. certainly the cultural things i’m referring to are informed by the regulatory and legal environment. but that’s not all that’s going on.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

true

to say that Americans are money loving, undisciplined, everything excessive, panic stricken people would be about right.

Here is a good quote for the John Monks, the secretary for the European Trade Union Corporation (ETUC) from yesterday that is pretty interesting:

“Capitalism’s worst enemies are today within its own ranks. These financial operators care nothing about climate change, new life-saving technologies or indeed anything of practical use. Their philosophy barely progresses beyond Abba’s refrain: "Money, money, money. It’s a rich man’s world." They must be stopped by the social democrats, by the trade unions, by European solidarity and by joint action with the United States and others. Otherwise, these financial monsters will destroy us and themselves in an orgy of speculation. "Saving Capitalism From Itself." It is not a slogan you usually see on the banners of trade unions, but it has never been more necessary than today.”

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

both of the two systems (and generalizations are certainly occurring here, largely out of necessity)

have their good points and bad points. and i’m not sure there really are ways to reach the aspirational happy middle ground which alleviates the bad points while preserving the good points of each, especially since they are operating within a much larger framework. one restrains growth and risk too much, while another probably encourages growth and risk too much.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

One is outweighing the other

right now. Dow is on the verge of dropping under 9000 right now.

If I had any money so to speak I would be buying anything and everything BUT financial stocks. Everything is at discount! The economy is at a discount! (maybe it will be reduced more in the coming days/weeks/mo.‘s gulp yr’s) – but a bird in the hand right now at these prices is a great long term investment.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

no no, I'm not talking about Europe

I am talking about here. I guess the same could be said for Europe, as the economies over their are sliding down the sh*tter too.

Look at the Pfizers, Proctor and Gambles, McDonalds, etc. Those firms that don’t have sh*t balance sheets, and have their stocks dropping because of the financial mess. These are good buys right now…

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh, I thought you were talking about discounts in the economy

we are outweighing the european markets right now….I don’t think they know how bad they are going to be just yet. I think they are getting ready to hit the iceberg. We already did and are sinking.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Warren buffet says:

“I sell when everyone else is getting crazy buying assets they are not knowledgabe about and I buy when everyone’s assets are distressed b/c of their craziness.”

Not in exact words but you get idea.

by The Scoper on Oct 9, 2008 3:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well said.

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:49 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

It was Nouriel Roubini

Columbia University economist who says the next shoe to drop will be the demise of thousands of hedge funds.

I’m ambivalent about how much respect economics deserves as a discipline, but he seems to know what he’s talking about.

by hitlesswonder on Oct 9, 2008 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, he does.

And he says 2000 banks will fail. And I agree – forced liquidation of funds means more supply is being dumped on the market, and no one is buying. Welcome to the worst market in 70+ years.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, it is.

Take cover.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

konerko to the angels is still alive!
BY JOE COWLEY jcowley@suntimes.com

Like the Sox, Los Angeles is a team in transition thanks to failed postseason runs year after year. The Sox could hold something the Angels need if Mark Teixeira signs a free-agent deal elsewhere, but that would mean Williams would have to talk Paul Konerko into waiving his no-trade clause.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/1208241,CST-SPT-sox08.article

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Oct 9, 2008 1:05 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

how about kendrick, weaver and figgins for konerko?

cowley is on crack!

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Oct 9, 2008 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Angels could use a DH...

regardless of what happens to Teixeira. But like I said elsewhere, I don’t think Paul Konerko nets you much value in trade right now.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Oct 9, 2008 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ditching his contract would be a good move

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Vlad will move to DH for them shortly.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

imagine if we coulda pulled off a trade last year for ervin santana

and had a rotation of buehrle, danks, floyd, santana, and vazquez

by Jbasic89 on Oct 9, 2008 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

1000 word pieces --

one would be enough

AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on Oct 9, 2008 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i'd expect that from an unabashed twins fan.

go back to twinkietown, homer.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 1:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I liked Minneapolis, but I couldn't find any decent pizza there

That, plus the snow in May thing…well, it just didn’t work out.

by hitlesswonder on Oct 9, 2008 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you're ever up there again, try the Italian Pie Shop in St. Paul for excellent deep dish pizza or Bascali's on Como in St. Paul (wood fired pizza)

both places are excellent

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just repeated myself

;)

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Assuming Beckham is all he's advertised to be...

will he be asked to play 3B since Alexi will be at SS?

Based on the Sox need for an extra power hitter, will Beckham be “fast tracked” and make his debut in 2009? If not, do we get a big dose of Josh Fields?

Who will start at 2nd? Juan? Getz?

"There will be surgery. It will heal. It will heal fast."- Carlos Quentin on NBC 5 News Chicago (9/5/08)

by tailgater on Oct 9, 2008 1:55 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

So, Fields at 3B...I assume Joe Crede is caput?

"There will be surgery. It will heal. It will heal fast."- Carlos Quentin on NBC 5 News Chicago (9/5/08)

by tailgater on Oct 9, 2008 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

frankly, i would imagine that ramirez will be asked to play second when beckham arrives, likely in 2010.

i see no reason why the sox should be deferential to a guy with ramirez’ bat, especially when it appears his defense will be no great shakes at SS. obviously things could change but i have always been quite confused about this whole “won’t the sox have to move beckham to x position” assumption that i read on this board all the time. people seem to be approaching this from an already settled vantage point for reasons that are unclear to me. beckham is your prized prospect; if he does what he’s projected to offensively and defensively, there shouldn’t be much question what position he will take.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Makes total sense

and I would think it would put KW in a good position as he can go after a SS via trade or FA and keep ramirez at 2B, or he can go after a 2B and move ramirez to SS or he can just move ramirez to SS and have someone like getz play 2B for a year until Beckham comes up in 2010 and they move ramirez back to 2B.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 2:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i haven't detailed any offseason plan yet.

but i don’t see the sox signing a long-term 2B/SS right now, largely for the reason laid out above. and it does provide some flexibility. i see KW going after someone like grudzielanek and pairing him with getz at 2B (the victor gets the most playing time or they make a decent L/R platoon or whatever), sticking alexei at SS, and expecting beckham to be ready in 2009 sometime. what the sox do may depend a bit upon what beckham looks like in the AFL against advanced competition but a one or two year stopgap at a middle infield position certainly makes a lot of sense, if that’s how KW wants to go.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

beckham ready in *2010* sometime.

clearly what the sox lack is more cowbell.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know, but now you did.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Oct 9, 2008 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Allen, Shelby and Beckham

are all on 2010 tracks from the looks of it, plus the possibility of some pitching regression makes me wonder if 2009 may be another Rebuild In Disguise. Which is to say, the Sox will try to compete but will make some risky bets they might not otherwise since they expect to reload in 2010.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

*Allen, Shelby, Beckham and Poreda

Anyone else I’m missing?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

that's a pretty solid top 4 prospects, come to think of it.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i would disagree with that.

and poreda is on track for 2009, not 2010.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

that's not a solid top 4?

Poreda will be ready to start a full season, like Danks, in 2010, imo. Next year could very well be Danks ‘07 style readiness, but that isn’t exactly the same thing, right?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i didn't include Danks for a reason

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

there's a reason he lasted so long in the draft, is all.

he’ll be at Kanny next year, maybe W-S. that’s a long way to go.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

I just remember reading something (I think from Gonzalez) about him being a 2nd round talent. It probably just had more to do with how dire the Sox farm system was/is.

by El Duque's Raft on Oct 9, 2008 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

he is a late second round talent.

not sure how that would change anything, though.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah i thought he lasted so long

because most teams thought he wasn’t signing

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 3:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

no. that's not a solid top four. unless you mean comparatively to recent years.

i am unimpressed by shelby. allen is a big question mark going forward, too. beckham is the only true blue chip prospect in that bunch. poreda is good but i’d also say their are questions surrounding him, as well, though things continue to look favorable.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i guess i'm just used to thinking of the Sox' system as such an endless abyss

that to see some real live position prospects gets me a little riled up. i sold on shelby and then he closed out well again this year and it got me thinking maybe he can be a CF version of Alexei.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:42 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

You're VASTLY overrating Shelby

he now carries the profile of a AA flop. And while Allen has some nice tools at the plate, it’s still a big leap of faith to think that he can continue his amazing growth of the past year to become even an average major league 1B

AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on Oct 9, 2008 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

that sounds more right to me.

i got caught up in some optimism for a sec there.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

you're really right about Shelby

if his plate discipline is as bad as it looks, his K rate is going to skyrocket and his average will end up in the 270s and we’ll be looking at another Brian Anderson.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

one of the few things we ended up agreeing on

but this optimism toward any and all Sox prospects keeps fighting back.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:43 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

2010, from my google doc:

C Pierzynski
1B Allen
2B Beckham
3B Fields
SS Ramirez
LF Quentin
CF ???
RF Swisher
DH Konerko

If you peg Allen as 25% chance at average, Fields at 30% and, say, Shelby at 5%, it’s pretty clear that the outlook for the 2010 Sox isn’t especially good on offense and that further talent is going to be acquired through free agency or trade. Konerko will probably not belong in the league as a real DH at that point, so there are significant holes at DH, 1B, CF and 3B to be repaired.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:48 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

i haven't really looked at it critically in a while (despite the fact that i said it was updated yesterday...not really true)

and I’m not sure what to think of Alexei. i had a comment way back when in March where I wondered when the other shoe would drop about Alexei. if it’s that he’s not a middle infielder, that would make sense. but i have to say that what I’ve read from the publisher’s of d metrics, one year of data should probably be taken with a significant grain of salt.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:54 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

use your eyes then. his range sucks.

i don’t see much reason to expect it to get better moving to SS.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

i'm not really prepared to comment on that i'd say

i didn’t see very many live games, positioning is a huge factor in playing the infield and i don’t think much of myself as a fielding scout in the first place. i feel good about pitching and okay about hitting, but i don’t know how to really scout fielding from my tv.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:00 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

here's the answer then, coming from your SSS expert on just about everything, including fielding.

he doesn’t have great range. i will also cite to one “the cheat” for the same proposition.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

you're probably right.

just voicing my reservations and such.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

so can he play CF then?

i think Swish should be there in 2009, but 2010 may mean the end of Swish’s capacity for the position.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ugh

stupid errant apostrophe. “publishers”.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

of course the obvious solution there is

CF. considering the dearth of prospects, my opinions on finding 2B and the hope that Beckham can play SS, that may well be the most logical spot for him anyway.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

So from that: JD, Bobby, Allen and Fields are the most tradable commodities

that is they have actual value in the market and we should be willing to part with them. That plus say 10 million dollars is the acquisition budget this year?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I still think you juxtapose Quentin and Swisher

And is AJ still a viable option at backstop two seasons from now? Not really stating an opinion one way or the other, just curious for the opinions of others.

"would've been a sweep if pablo was here" -Kenwo-

by Hazymania on Oct 9, 2008 2:51 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

he's signed.

there’s your viability.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

like larry says

he’s there because he’s signed. if he’s going to be a backup in 2010, that’d be nice to know, but i see no obvious alternatives and i can’t exactly throw up a ??? when i know AJ will be under contract.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:55 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

6.5 in 2010 dollars

is kind of in between isn’t it? looks like bet hedging to me, weighting salary by expectation: 30% of the time he’s a backup, 40% he’s a below average starter and 30% he’s an average starter/

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

uh, i'm not sure i agree with that, like, at all.

$6.5M doesn’t look anywhere near what a team would pay a backup. as in, i doubt (m)any teams would pay half of that for a backup.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it looks like maybe you didn't understand, but that's rarely the case

 6.5 M 70% of an average salary in 2010 makes the average catcher getting 9 per. i have no idea if that’s accurate or not, but it sounds right.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

my ignorance is on display.

i haven’t looked anything up. what will a league average catcher make per in 2010?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:16 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

also "juxtapose" isn't usually used like that to my knowledge

fwiw. you are intending to say “switch Quentin and Swisher’s respective positions” right?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

right right

apologies.

Glad you got what I was trying to say.

"would've been a sweep if pablo was here" -Kenwo-

by Hazymania on Oct 9, 2008 3:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

well in addressing that

i’d say it’s kind of splitting hairs, but if Swish can nominally play center and Quentin can’t, the guy with better range should go in right. right?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

When you put it that way, I see what you're saying.

Isn’t there some question of arm strength (throwing) that comes into play when fielding right and left? Are Swisher and Quentin that different in this area? I seem to recall something being made of Swisher’s ability to throw out runners, whereas Quentin has showed off his arm on a few occasions.

Just curious what people think.

"would've been a sweep if pablo was here" -Kenwo-

by Hazymania on Oct 9, 2008 3:12 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

quentin has also shown off his apparent inability to field his position.

though i suppose, just like JD, having a strong arm could prove helpful while attempting to stem the bleeding of doubles into triples.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

With that being said

Where do you think a stronger arm is more valuable? In right field, where the reduction of first to thirds and triples comes into play? Or is it more of an asset in left, where throwing runners going home on a tag more than likely comes into play more often with the majority of big league hitters being right handed?

Or is it a moot point all together?

"would've been a sweep if pablo was here" -Kenwo-

by Hazymania on Oct 9, 2008 3:19 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Gotcha

So based solely on the team’s probably position in 2010, how does everyone else see the outfield corners being laid out?

"would've been a sweep if pablo was here" -Kenwo-

by Hazymania on Oct 9, 2008 3:24 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

I doubt you'll see too many answers different than mine and larry's

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry

I missed Larry’s projected lineup.

"would've been a sweep if pablo was here" -Kenwo-

by Hazymania on Oct 9, 2008 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Possibilities in the OC mode:

2009 SS FA:

Bobby Crosby
Alex Gonzalez
Khalil Greene
John McDonald
Ramon Santiago
Miguel Tejada
Jack Wilson

Khalil is the guy who jumps out to me, but he had a bit of a disaster season didn’t he? His batting approach is the kind that would play pretty well in The Cell. I don’t see the Pads having much use for JD though.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:15 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

man he really imploded

San Diego would really be selling low on him.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Man Crosby just has not had the career I thought he would have

Without looking at the numbers I was thinking he’d be an interesting pickup, but looking at the numbers he’s had 1 good year in 6 and none in a while. I can’t convince myself that he’s liable to start being god now.

by hitlesswonder on Oct 9, 2008 3:26 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

not a lot to convince of that one, really.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

that's just a really unexciting list, basically.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

which is why the 2B list is much tastier.

assuming you’re looking for cheap, stopgap types who will provide mediocre production. which is what i think the sox should be looking at.

by larry on Oct 9, 2008 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

so you think Alexei will slide over for 2009 then?

looking at the state of SS in the MLB right now, it looks like as long as he isn’t a disaster in the field he’ll be useful there.

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 3:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who, outside of Ellis, is available at 2B?

This is directed at anyone, btw, despite being a reply to larry.

I’m interested in who would be cheap and provide mediocre production and who wouldn’t be an “A” free agent.

A site with FA listings would be great if you don’t want to copy and paste into the thread. Also, I’m assuming that looking at relative values by win shares is the preferred method, no?

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 4:48 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

we would want an outstanding defender there basically right?

with an adequate bat?

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's what I would assume

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

ellis' away number are solid

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 9, 2008 5:39 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

thank you

this isn't hard. you live in a port city. and you're a slut. do the math. -larry

by rhythm on Oct 9, 2008 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nothing to do w/ Sox...

…but i just got back from a ‘lunch’ at an empty LA rest — a place known for show biz lunches. Owner told me his biz (both lunch and dinner) is off 40% since spring. Retail is also falling apart around town. Same around the country?

by RoyEgan on Oct 9, 2008 3:37 PM CDT reply actions   0 recs

Yes.

Can’t talk specifics, but, yes, FL is getting clobbered within the last 2-3 weeks, specifically because of international biz drying up. AZ looks tough too – got a client who works with Wal-mart and Lowes doing the paving of their parking lots (don’t laugh – $100M business). Business off 70% – that’s right, 70% – over last year.

Shelter from the storm, man.

I apologize for nothing.

by winningugly on Oct 9, 2008 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

mercy

been in this academic bubble and haven’t realized how bad things are, pray to Q! my offer doesn’t get revoked

"...fined for what, hittin' the ball into outer space?"

by Illini0509 on Oct 9, 2008 4:44 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

nope (or at least, not yet)

i guess it just depends on your business and market

I don’t want my beer to taste like fruit or honey. I want pussy to taste that way.

by thatshortkid on Oct 9, 2008 5:56 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

portsluttery is thriving.

...and then some depressed fucked-cake eating.

by homesickalien on Oct 9, 2008 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

it is a recession-proof industry

I don’t want my beer to taste like fruit or honey. I want pussy to taste that way.

by thatshortkid on Oct 9, 2008 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

and you guys think i'm just a stupid portslut.

...and then some depressed fucked-cake eating.

by homesickalien on Oct 9, 2008 7:23 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

in the words of leonardo

i don’t think…I KNOW

nothing gets ‘em wetter than infrequent postings on the city’s second favorite team

by colintj on Oct 10, 2008 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions   0 recs

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