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May Fan Satisfaction Results

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At first, I found the results a bit surprising. How could the majority of readers be less satisfied with the current team than earlier in the year? Then I looked at the date of the last poll.

When last we did this, the Sox were just coming off a 18-0 pasting of the Detroit Tigers over two games. So I'm not surprised that some of the excitement has worn off. It's the Dog Days of May.

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Still surprising

that the excitement and satisfaction results are at their lowest levels even though we’re in 1st place by 1.5 games and 6.5 ahead of the Tigers.

by RME JICO on May 20, 2008 8:58 AM CDT   0 recs

Still recovering

from that Blue Jays / Twins trip I guess. That really took the wind out of our sails for awhile I think. After last year I think it will take more then a sweep of the worst team in the league to give the fans confidence the team can be a contendor all year.

by Grinder in Training on May 20, 2008 9:42 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

As Steve Earle once said in song...

“I ain’t ever satisfied.”

"We're gonna bring it all day, everyday...we're gonna keep grinding it out." - Nick Swisher (4/1/08)

by tailgater on May 20, 2008 9:13 AM CDT   0 recs

Ah, Steve

Last night I dreamed I made it to the promise land
I was standin’ at the gate and I had the key in my hand
Saint Peter said “Come on in boy, you’re finally home”
I said “No thanks Pete, I’ll just be moving along”

by Landfill on May 20, 2008 9:58 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Padres almost ready to move players...

“Towers seeing red after tough loss
If changes come, they’ll be big ones, angry GM says”

Could Kenny bring Iguchi back? After a bad April, Iguchi has had a pretty good May ( .299 / .338 / .448 / .786 ). Iguchi signed a 1-year deal with the Padres for $3.85 million so he would be fairly cheap for the rest of the season and maybe we could trade Michael Dubee for him. I would like to see what Richar can do but will he be ready any time soon?

by SSH2005 on May 20, 2008 10:21 AM CDT   0 recs

And this move would coincide with the release of Ozuna...

Then, Uribe would be the backup utility infielder.

by SSH2005 on May 20, 2008 10:24 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I give you credit:

Last week you wanted Cintron back, along with Phat Freddy. Wanting Tadahito is an uptick (even if he’d be our what, 17th 2B on the roster?).

Once again, it ain’t the periphery I’d worry about. It’s the bats of Knerko, Thome, and Dye.

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 20, 2008 10:34 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I never said that I wanted Freddy back...

I said that he wouldn’t be the worst option if Floyd’s peripherals finally make him fall flat on his face. I said that Colon would have been the best option and he is going to be pitching for the Red Sox soon. Cintron is garbage but it doesn’t take much to be a better hitter than Uribe. Even going from Uribe to Iguchi is a big upgrade in the lineup offensively. I don’t consider us having many 2B when they are all untalented trash that most teams wouldn’t even have on their roster (Ozuna), much less being starting second basemen (Uribe).

I guess Ramirez could just keep hitting to make this a moot point but we’ll see.

by SSH2005 on May 20, 2008 10:44 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

echoing chiburb

uribe is batting 9

"I got the shotgun. You got the briefcase. It's all in the game though, right? "

by onlysoxfaninboston on May 20, 2008 10:45 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

At least I'm not this guy...

Link:

I’m wondering if the White Sox might give some thought to giving Jerry Owens some playing time at second base while he’s in Charlotte. He should have the agility to play second, and a number of players have successfully made those types of switches. Even if his defense isn’t immediately great, his offense would more than make up for the anemic production we’re getting from Uribe, Ozuna and Ramirez.
—Mike, Columbus

Before fans start lambasting me for including a question that obviously isn’t plausible on any level, I threw this in the mailbag to show how badly the public wanted Owens on the team not too long ago. It was a strong enough desire to suggest a left-hander play second and risk life and limb.

With all due respect to Owens’ abilities, the emphatic pleas for his arrival have stopped since the team started winning and hitting again.

by SSH2005 on May 20, 2008 10:56 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

wow, there are just so many things wrong with that.

"For those that don't understand stats... that ops is horrifying."

by Toonderstrook on May 20, 2008 10:58 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

can he make the 90 foot throw?

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on May 20, 2008 7:10 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Battle for the shittiest

I’d still take Uribe over Cintron.

I'm a disgruntled Whitesox fan and I can't spell

by chisox on May 20, 2008 1:58 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Remember when this

poll started we were a .500 team tied for 2nd place. I’m very sure that if we took the poll right now (5 game win streak, hottest team or at least longest win streak in mlb, 1st place, 2nd best run differential in AL) it would be sig. better than 3 days ago.

by bhoov on May 20, 2008 10:29 AM CDT   0 recs

That's too logical and, may I add, too researched. The real reason for the surprise is

that SSH voted 27 times.

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 20, 2008 10:52 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Question

I was listening to sports talk yesterday – yes I know, that is my first mistake. But, I was stuck in the car and needed something to keep me awake all day.

Anyways, they were discussing PED’s in baseball and what that has done to statistics, especially this year (I know only a small sample size so far) especially those stats of 31-34 year olds and how the majority have them have been mediocare at best. If you go back at look at the stats for this age group from mid 90’s through last year the offensive statistics of this group were greater than other ager groups by far. Sure there are a couple of players, Berkman for example who is 32 who is still playing lights out…but on the whole these players have trended like most in the history of the game besides the “steroid era” where they typically start to decline.

SO, my point being is – many of you use historical stats, formula’s, baseball prospectus projections etc. for players/teams and how they will perform during the year based on this history. Question, being – are these formula’s still accurate since it looks like a lot of these players that were offensive powerhouses the last 3-years, etc. and could have been on PED are now playing like average or below average players, thus throwing some of the hisorical statistics out the window when trying to evaulate future projections?

Just wondering your thoughts, insight.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 20, 2008 11:17 AM CDT   0 recs

I think the effect of PEDs...

on overall offensive output was minimal at best.

Personally, although I have very little evidence for this, I think most of this has to do with the balls.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 11:21 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

or lack thereof outside of CF in SFO?

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 20, 2008 11:31 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The impact of PEDs

Will never be accurately quantified on a league wide basis. First, it’s impossible to tell how many players were doing what when. It’s also impossible to discern where impact of better conditioning (see: Thome, Jim) ends and PEDs start.

I’d argue many older players are simply taking better care of themselves, which has extended peaks. What impact PEDs has had on this is impossible to say.

by madvillian on May 20, 2008 12:14 PM CDT   0 recs

To expand on that thought

With the amount of money players get paid these days, they don’t need to have an off-season job. I think that goes a long way to help them train and rehab, if necessary.

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.

by rhythm on May 20, 2008 12:21 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I know it is impossible

to quantify who was doing what and to what extent. But, look at the numbers last year and this year compared to the last 10-15. Drop offs were/are enormous and what I am saying is that the 31-34 year old players have dropped off the most. So, better conditioning of older players is not relevant.

Trends are showing that ballplayers in this age genre were using PED’s to extend their careers and it was swaying offensive statistics and thus making a large part of those statistics in the past 10-years irrelevant, in my opinion.

Thus, how do you quantify any of it in today’s projections? That is my question.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 20, 2008 12:26 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Why Does Everyone Assume That Steroids Only Aided Offense?

Baseball, unlike, say, track and field, is a game of directly opposed efforts. Just as batters are trying to get hits, pitchers and defenders are trying to stop them. We know from the Mitchell Report and other badinage that plenty of pitchers are under the same steroid cloud as Messrs. Bonds, McGuire, etc. Seems to me there was a prominent starter from Texas who was recently in the news regarding steroid allegations (and singer, bartender and golfer’s wife indiscretionss), but his name escapes me.

The point is that PEDs were used by all types of players and, if steroids help you improve or extend your baseball career, their benefits were felt by all manner of players. For every Bonds who you say unnaturally extended his career, thus inflating offensive totals, there’s a Clemens who unnaturally extended his career, thus suppressing offensive totals. Similarly, if there is PED boost, wouldn’t that boost apply equally to old and young players? Doesn’t the wide-spread dissemination of an advantageous technology keep the system in equilibrium?

Now, I suppose you could speculate that, somehow, PEDs give an advantage to hitters but not pitchers or defenders. You could make up some kind of rationalization that the old benefit more from PEDs than the young. But, unless you have some actual evidence to support such speculation, you’re just guessing and its hard to have much of a conversation that’s based only on guesses.

by Landfill on May 20, 2008 12:58 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree

that it also effected pitching and defense. But it is harder to quantify and stats show that HR’s increased at a disgusting rate during the so called “PED Era” – thus it looks like hitters had the advantage. What would have happened if pitchers weren’t on PED’s at this time, well the stats may have looked even more swayed.

Look at this article:
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8152100/Rats,-not-bats,-may-be-behind-NL’s-resurgence

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 20, 2008 1:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I still think...

the baseballs were juiced.

Not deliberately, mind you, but Rawlings moved their facility for making baseballs from Haiti to the Dominican Republic in the early ‘90s, and home runs started flying out at a suspiciously high rate not long after.

And I don’t think it was a coincidence that, after MLB launched an investigation in 2000-01, the worst of the offensive explosion cooled off.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 1:23 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Can I call Occam?

I much prefer the simplicity of your argument. For one, considering the uncertainty surrounding who did what and exactly what that what can do to a person’s ability to play baseball, the amount of prosecution done on the basis of assumptions that have never been well proven to my knowledge seems way out of line. On the other hand, a different ball would easily explain the differences seen, right?

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on May 20, 2008 7:16 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Well

Normalized stats should correct somewhat. If the whole league was tearing it up then we can put some seasons in perspective of what could be called a “steroid era” I guess.

Pedro emerges as perhaps the best pitcher of all time.

by madvillian on May 20, 2008 12:36 PM CDT   0 recs

Again...

that assumes that steroids, and not something else, caused the increase in offense. This is not clear AFAIK.

It also assumes that steroid testing has succeeded in eliminating PEDs from the sport, which is another dubious claim.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 12:41 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

True

Sure looks like something was eliminated though.

Any of this taken into account with say, ZiPS projections??

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 20, 2008 12:52 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

It should also be noted...

that while offense is down significantly in the AL, it is not down in the NL. I’m not sure what the issue is, but it would be an odd steroid policy indeed that affected one league and not the other.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 12:44 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

that's one way to parity!

"For those that don't understand stats... that ops is horrifying."

by Toonderstrook on May 20, 2008 12:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Well..

couldn’t you say the same thing about your crazy ass ball argument that I really thought you were joking about when I read your first post? They are using the same balls in both leagues.. if the ball was juiced, why is the NL still able to hit homeruns and the AL is hitting less?
Did the NL just keep all their old juiced balls b/c they weren’t flying over the fences before and have them saved over from past years? I really just hope my sarcasm detector is broken and your joking about the ball issue.

The way I would look at it is, the AL currently has bigger market teams and has for awhile now. Big Market teams can afford stars in their prime, and stars over 30, the “great players” of the PED era. The stars of the last 10 years included a lot of guys using PEDs, and until those guys retire, or finish up their big contracts they are going to be there, taking up rosters spots, not hitting as many home runs and basically sucking, in the AL. These are the players that have the biggest adjustment to make from not using steroids.

NL teams (on average) are smaller market, and rely more on homegrown stars, and therefore are going to be able to adjust quicker to the new drug enforcement policies b/c they don’t have as many big stars from the steroid era still under contract. These young guys that are tearing it up in the NL right now had steroid testing in the minors when they came up, and have had testing since they got to the big leagues, therefore you wouldn’t expect to see as big a drop off, so no one would think they would have any problem with the new drug policy.

Obviously there are plenty of exceptions to this like any other theory (Carlos Delgado, Troy Glaus for example make a home in the NL currently), but if you want an explanation for a league wide drop in one league and not the other that makes a lot more sense then juiced balls does.

by Grinder in Training on May 20, 2008 2:20 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I think that the baseballs...

were responsible for the increase in offense in 1993-94. I have no idea why offense is down in the AL this year. I’m waiting to see if this is just a fluke before I advance any theories as to 2008 in particular.

If you look closely at the years 1992-1994, offense increased for just about everyone, not just a portion of the league. So either just about every hitter in MLB started taking them at the same time, or there was something else going on.

As to PEDs, I’m not seeing a lot of evidence that the league-wide effect of PEDs is more runs across the board. Pitchers took (take?) ‘em too. They might have helped some hitters, but people tend to advance the “PEDs cause more runs” theory as if it was a truism. I’d have to see more evidence of that.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 2:28 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Assuming pitchers did take them

As I do.. they would be able to throw harder.. harder pitch.. harder swing = home runs going up.
This would also work for my theory that the AL had the more expensive players (I.E. the ones juicing performing at a higher level, those able to throw the ball faster then a non-juicing pitcher).

by Grinder in Training on May 20, 2008 2:40 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The thing is...

as I said, that offense increased for just about everyone, not just a select portion of the league, in 1993-94. Almost every hitter saw their offensive numbers increase (once you adjust for age), and almost every pitcher gave up more runs. Like I said, either almost every hitter in the league starting using steroids at the same time, or something else was going on.

And the change was dramatic, overnight. It wasn’t a gradual increase, like you’d expect if the main culprit was PED’s, nor did it continue to increase as more effective PEDs were introduced.

PED’s may have played some role in the increase in offense – it’s hard to parse out from the data, considering that we may never know who was juicing and who was not. But there’s not a lot of evidence that it’s the primary culprit.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 2:44 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

the decline of the DH is probably part of the reason

how many teams so far are actually getting legitimate production from that spot so far this year – i’m talking like a .300 EqA or above. four? maybe? the level of play by DH’s this year is atrocious.

by larry on May 20, 2008 2:47 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd agree with that,

but, can’t you look at the reduced use of PED’s as the cause of that decline? DH’s are by definition pretty one-dimensional, and that one dimension can be really helped by using PED’s. Less guys aging well enough to fill those spots?

by Grinder in Training on May 20, 2008 3:00 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you could easily look at it the opposite way

“young” guys are able to stay at a position longer now and thus there’s a dearth of “middle-aged” players to replace the “old” players who have sucked this year.

or one could not worry much about what a group of about 18 players have collectively done for 45 games.

by larry on May 20, 2008 3:04 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i noticed that when i voted my 25 times for Q!

very few deserving DHs this year and A TON of atrocious ones.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on May 20, 2008 7:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

speaking of steroids
Q. Will Barry Bonds go to jail as a Pirate or a Giant?


A. It would depend on the size of the jail cell.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/wnba/363611_chad19.html

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on May 20, 2008 1:50 PM CDT   0 recs

LOL!

Awesome

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.

by rhythm on May 20, 2008 2:23 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I am one, who is disappointed

about this season thus far. We should have a lot better record than we do.

"I would rather have a battalion of German soldiers in front of me than a platoon of French soldiers behind me."

by Where Triples Go to Die on May 20, 2008 2:11 PM CDT   0 recs

See, there's the downside...

to pie-eyed optimism – reality is always such a bitch.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 2:14 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

don't be such a debbie downer, jre.

all the sox need to do to reach his projection is go 74-45 (.622) the rest of the way.

"For those that don't understand stats... that ops is horrifying."

by Toonderstrook on May 20, 2008 2:19 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

are you saying that we

cant? If our pitching holds up anywhere close to where it has been, and our offense does ANYTHING we will win 90 games. link to my projection…

"I would rather have a battalion of German soldiers in front of me than a platoon of French soldiers behind me."

by Where Triples Go to Die on May 20, 2008 2:47 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The offense is doing something.

The Sox currently have a league-average offense.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 20, 2008 2:49 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

yet somehow in the upper-third in the majors in avg. with RISP.

"For those that don't understand stats... that ops is horrifying."

by Toonderstrook on May 20, 2008 2:56 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

shit. my bad.

i forgot how the relative clutchiness can only be gauged following the season.

"For those that don't understand stats... that ops is horrifying."

by Toonderstrook on May 20, 2008 3:04 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

some sabr guys even question whether you can do it that soon

what will a single world series win mean in 350 years? to be truly clutch, i think you’ll need at least 12 seasons of clutchy hits. adjusted for all-time, of course, considering guys will be playing until they’re WU’s age then. or at least until they’re 61.

by larry on May 20, 2008 3:07 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Holy Keehrist

what will a single world series win mean in 350 years? Dust in the wind. Leave it to larry to put it all in perspective. In the long run, none of us is clutch, because we’re all dead.

Happy Tuesday, everyone!

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 20, 2008 3:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i dont need sabr guys.

history is nothing but the past, man. i’m living in the now and what my eyes tell me. and if they tell me this team isn’t a good offensive team, then it isn’t. period.

increased batting average over the last two weeks without crazy babip? luck
high oba relative to al? too many walks and not enough singles
high slg relative to al? too many homers and not enough doubles and triples
top 3 in runs per game in the al? must be using new math
top 7 in ba with risp in mlb? sox still leaving too many guys stranded on first who reached with 2 outs

"For those that don't understand stats... that ops is horrifying."

by Toonderstrook on May 20, 2008 3:12 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

third in the AL in runs per game.

"For those that don't understand stats... that ops is horrifying."

by Toonderstrook on May 20, 2008 2:55 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Chocolate Salty Balls:

2 Tbsp. cinnamon
2 or 3 egg whites
1/2 stick melted butter
1 cup flour
1/4 cup unsweetened chocolate
1/2 cup brandy
1 or 2 bags sugar
Directions: Mix the cinnamon, egg whites, and melted butter in a bowl with a wooden spoon. Mix in the flour, then the unsweetened chocolate, brandy, sugar, and vanilla. Place balls on a greased cookie sheet and bake in an oven preheated to 350 degrees. Care should be taken when baking, as the length of time in the oven is not specified.

“I love your chocolate salty balls, Chef!
“You’ve got the best balls in the whole world, Chef!”

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 20, 2008 2:45 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What about Pete Schwety's Christmas balls, Chi? Or his Schwety Weiner?

A couple of the funnier Alec Baldwin SNL skits ever.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 20, 2008 2:52 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Being old, I stick with Isaac Hayes

Say everybody, have you seen my balls?
They’re big and salty and brown.
If you ever need a quick pick-me-up
Just stick my balls in your mouth.
Oooh, suck on my chocolate, salty balls.
(Put ‘em in your mouth!)
Put ‘em in your mouth and suck ‘em and suck ‘em…

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 20, 2008 2:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

LOL. You are going to be a grandpa some day.

I feel for those kids. MY grandpa didn’t quote Isaac Hayes. “Course he barely spoke English and was working for Bugs Moran.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 20, 2008 3:07 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Made grandpa 3 weeks ago!

And the Seattle daughter gave ME the South Park Movie for Xmas one year. And her fave movie of all time is Pulp Fiction, which she saw when she was 12 (I think).
See what happens when you let dirty effin hippies have babies?

Besides, they both know that they were ‘cocaine babies”. Without it, I would never have beem with their mother.

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 20, 2008 3:25 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

been

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 20, 2008 3:25 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

He didn't officially retire

....he still plays for “both” teams.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 20, 2008 2:31 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Nice.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 20, 2008 2:32 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs