8 - South Side Sox

8

by The Cheat on May 23, 2008 12:18 AM CDT in Recaps Comment 167 comments

After the 2005 season, 8-game winning streaks feel a little more special. The Sox put together 4 separate 8-game streaks that year, with the last one culminating in a pile of World Series champions on the Houston infield. So running their winning streak to 8 holds a little more meaning, at least for this fan.

I don't want to diminish the Sox sweep -- and my superstitious side would never have allowed me to bring this up during the series itself -- but they caught Cleveland at the right time. The tribe scored 4 runs in the series, and managed just 13 hits in 27 innings (90 at-bats, .144 average). Sure, part of that is good pitching, but much of it is a Cleveland squad which hasn't scored more than 4 runs in any of their last 11 games, averaging 2.34 R/G over that stretch.

I don't want to further diminish the Sox streak, so I won't, even though I could. Superstitions, you know?

On the game

Remember yesterday when I said that I only write about what I want to write about, that I write for me? Well, I was writing a boring recap of an otherwise good game, and my heart wasn't in it. So I deleted it.

Sometimes it's best to say nothing when you just don't have anything interesting to say. Quentin rules.

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Was that BP Fanshot from yesterday behind the subscriber wall?

If so, another win moved it to Sports Illustrated

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/baseball/mlb/05/22/bp.whitesox/index.html?eref=si_mlb

AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on May 23, 2008 1:05 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

"They haven't had an injury, they haven't made a significant lineup change, and they haven't played around with roles."

Did I miss something or did Ozzie make a huge shake up in the line up?

"I would rather have a battalion of German soldiers in front of me than a platoon of French soldiers behind me."

by Where Triples Go to Die on May 23, 2008 9:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sox' injury avoidance is HUGE, HUGE, HUGE, HUGE, HUGE, HUGE, HUGE, HUGE, HUGE, HUGE (Underlined, in neon red).

Thome
Konerko
Dye
Crede
Contreras

These guys are all somewhat major injury risks.

And God forbid, our player who had off-season shoulder surgery has ANY problems.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Speaking of "our player who had off-season shoulder surgery,"

IMO, Ozzie should sit “our player who had off-season shoulder surgery” down one day soon and let him rest. He’s got to have a lot of stress, physical and mental.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Couldn't agree more.

For God’s sake, he’s earned it!

by palehose67 on May 23, 2008 9:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

When folks are treating you as The Second Coming

those shoulders get a little tired.

“HEAL YOURSELVES!” is coming once he actually slumps.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 9:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

he just had an offday monday

like everyone else. it’s not like the shoulder surgery is something that has ongoing effects. i guess an offday once in awhile during a longish stretch of games isn’t a bad idea but this team needs to ride him as long as it can.

by larry on May 23, 2008 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Judgement call. Ozzie's pretty good at resting his players.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Q! isn't an AARP card-carrier like messrs. Thome and Konerko

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on May 23, 2008 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

or Bally and WU

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 23, 2008 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Interesting you exclude yourself from such an august group.

Hoary one, you.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, you're an august group. I'm more September.

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 23, 2008 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

57 in Sept?

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You can't sit him

until we lose a game to end this winning streak. I have to see Kaplan dye his hair pink.

"I would rather have a battalion of German soldiers in front of me than a platoon of French soldiers behind me."

by Where Triples Go to Die on May 23, 2008 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thome, Konerko, Dye and Crede are huge injury risks.. but Fields can fill in for Crede, Konerko and Thome, so I think we are somewhat protected there. With how bad Konerko has looked (Thome too I guess) I doubt Fields would even be a drop big off for us in talent right now. (I’m obviously assuming Fields can play 1B if he can play 3B, I could be wrong).

And.. in a pinch he could play LF again if Dye was hurt for a short period of time with Quinton showing off the arm in RF.

BA has really shown himself as a major league player to help out in a shorter term injury too, not sure you can win a championship with him as your starting CF all season; but he’s shown he’s serviceable enough to fill in if Dye or Q went on the 15 day DL in my opinion.

I realize our bench is thin; but like Larry brought up yesterday, you can add Fields to that bench and he’s a lot better then most guys we would get through a trade right now.

Fields, Anderson, Uribe, Hall is a really solid major league bench post all-star break in my opinion.

by Grinder in Training on May 23, 2008 9:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not that it's been overlooked,

but BA has been very impressive in his role.

Maybe the most important thing has been him enthusiastically accepting his role. When they show dugout shots of the high fives, BA has always been right there, participating in and enjoying the moment.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

"Fields, Anderson, Uribe, Hall..."

I agree, but this will require Ozuna being released. What would make that move more likely to happen? Perhaps if Alexei regresses, I can see Fields being brought up and Alexei brought down…

Fields, Anderson, Ozuna, Hall

Not perfect by any means, but if there is some IF we can acquire closer to July, this would be OK for now.

"I got the shotgun. You got the briefcase. It's all in the game though, right? "

by onlysoxfaninboston on May 23, 2008 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What's the current status on Richar

Could he ready to play by July??

"I got the shotgun. You got the briefcase. It's all in the game though, right? "

by onlysoxfaninboston on May 23, 2008 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

My assumption

Has either Ramirez continuing to play well and taking the 2B job or Richar being healthy and taking the 2B job. (I’d guess Ramirez is more likely then Richar to take the job at this point). That is probably a reach on my part; but otherwise it seems reasonable. And yes.. it would mean Ozuna being released.

by Grinder in Training on May 23, 2008 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

HAHAHAHA

they say the 2005 team had this excellent defense, and this year’s doesnt. Well, we are better at SS, 2B, LF and pretty much the same everywhere else. Explain again how great that 2005 defense was?

by Rockraines on May 23, 2008 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

let's see, 0.720 v. 0.706 in defensive efficiency?

and, no, the sox are certainly not better at SS, i’m fairly certain pods was better in 2005 than Q has been so far, and 2B is also a debatable point. and the 2008 JD is certainly different than the 2005 JD. and there was this guy. i think he was a legend. something rowand? played center.

by larry on May 23, 2008 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Q! has dropped 2 or 3 balls,

while his arm has stopped more than a handful of runners from advancing.

Disagree, ‘05 Pods not better than Q!-to-date.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 12:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i really don't want to have this facile argument again regarding pods' defense

especially in 2005. pods was better. and it’s probably not close.

by larry on May 23, 2008 12:23 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

"i’m fairly certain pods was better in 2005 than Q has been so far"

Please elaborate.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

no thanks

seems like i have to do this one every few months. tired of it. if people want to think pods was a horrible, horrible defender, go blithely on.

by larry on May 23, 2008 12:36 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Reading a lot into my thoughts, Larry.

Q! dropped a few balls, but his arm has stopped many, many advances.

With that, I’ll go blithely on.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

okay, then if people want to think quentin is a great, great defender, go blithely on.

by larry on May 23, 2008 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

'05 Pods vs '08 Q

strickly on defense? I guess I’d go with ‘08 Q. Pods could get to more balls, but Q’s arm is pretty darn impressive. But an arm is a hard thing to measure since you don’t know what the reputation for the arm might have stopped from even being attempted. Don’t get me wrong, I will forever love Pods for what he did for the team in ‘05, but Q is not shabby out there. And I also just want to say the word blithely.

by palehose67 on May 23, 2008 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

She is quite the hot movie star.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 1:57 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

From what I have seen...

And this is based off of seeing Quentin 8 times this year in person so small sample size but…

‘05 Pods had superior positioning as well as got much better reads off the bat. His speed also allowed him to get to more balls than Quentin (as pointed out already). But I think Quentin also suffers from having a poor defensive center fielder which I believe Swisher is.

And while Scott had a rag arm, he was adept at getting to balls quick and then getting them back in quick. His arm always surprised me when he would have to track a double to the left field corner, pivot and throw without the benefit of lining anything up.

Odd taking up for Pods though, I really got down on him at games last year. And please forgive me for I have sinned, I have taken the Q! in vain…

Caulk the wagon.

by rebstock on May 23, 2008 2:52 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'll just assume this was a joke that translate well to the internet.

by Grinder in Training on May 23, 2008 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

When your hot like the Sox, a recap isn't needed

The excellence speaks for itself, as do the wins. As much (deserved) credit as Q-dini is getting for this start, I think Linebrink is generally being overlooked. It’s a seven inning game right now with he and Jenks around, and with our starters throwing 6 or 7 good innings a night, the Sox are a tough team to beat to say the least.

Also, Toby is hitting a shockingly impresive .361 (small sample size alert for the previous and the upcoming), including 7 for 14 against lefties. He only has the two doubles for extra base hits along with 13 singles, but he also only has 3 strikeouts in 37 at bats (but also, no walks, yikes). Point is, he looks more like KW thought he would, at least so far this season.

The south will rise again...

by whitesoxfan101 on May 23, 2008 1:24 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

.351*

for Toby’s average.

The south will rise again...

by whitesoxfan101 on May 23, 2008 1:25 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

TOBY! TOBY! TOBY!

Could it be that the Sox actually have a solid backup catcher?!?

C'mon, Smokey! This isn't 'Nam, it's bowling. There are rules!

by thekever on May 23, 2008 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Lot of hits in the last 10 days.

I’m not sure if there’s ever been a streak of consecutive “ducksnorts” (the only line of Hawk’s that I like) like what we’ve just witnessed.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

last night

toby looked great at the plate from where i was sitting in on the first base side.

by hugh on May 23, 2008 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

His throw on the OC error was high (it was properly called an error on OC,

but not a great throw) and it looked like he wound up from the dugout in releasing it – HUGE effort for him, it looked like. I wouldn’t get married to the idea of him being The Answer as backup – he has good splits against LHP, AJ was in there catching the last inning, and as long as he doesn’t completely embarass himself at the plate we have a decent option if/when AJ needs a rest.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 10:23 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

backup catcher = pretty good job to have

people dont expect too much from you. Basically, just dont f up. Get a big hit now and then. Look like you can “call a good game.” You’re a hero.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

from reading this and other sox sites

seems like people do expect a lot from a backup catcher.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Those 24th and 25th guys make the difference

when you have a really thin margin of error (like we did in ‘05, and are lookin’ like in ‘08).

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 10:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not really.

It’s good to see some production, however.

C'mon, Smokey! This isn't 'Nam, it's bowling. There are rules!

by thekever on May 23, 2008 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

All I expect...

is the ability to handle the position. I don’t expect any offensive production – if the guy could hit, he wouldn’t be a backup.

Toby Hall was once a very solid catcher all the way around. Ever since he screwed up his shoulder, however, he’s been pretty bad.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 23, 2008 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He was released by the Rays before his shoulder was injured

He wasn’t very good, except against LHP.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He was actually traded...

to the Dodgers, as part of the package that got them Dioner Navarro.

The Dodgers didn’t bring him back, because they had Russell Martin.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 23, 2008 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

OK - but what #'s did he have for Tampa? Not good.

IIRC, his pickup was lauded by some, panned by other (some attached personality reasons for the pan). Either way, I thought we pretty much agreed he’s be a decent guy against LHP.

Good trade for the Rays, BTW (thanks for correcting me). Navarro’s kickin’ tail.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I liked the pickup at the time...

because as you say, he could hit lefties and he used to have a decent throwing arm. Pierzynski, I thought, needed a platoon partner.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 23, 2008 11:45 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

streaks are important

Nice stat on the 4 8-gamers from ‘05. That’s 32 of their final 36 game W-L differential that year, post season not included. Hope they ride this thing a good while longer.

Nancy Faust belongs in the Hall of Fame

by '77 Hitmen Fan on May 23, 2008 8:21 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Yes, she does!!!

I miss Nancy.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 9:47 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Gotta get her to play "I Got Q! Babe" introducing his at bats.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Doesn't she still do weekends?

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

She does day games - at least that was last year, not sure this year

by Brush Back on May 23, 2008 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

When did Nancy stop

doing the organ?

"I would rather have a battalion of German soldiers in front of me than a platoon of French soldiers behind me."

by Where Triples Go to Die on May 23, 2008 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Catching Cleveland at the right time...

...I can remember many Sox teams that when they caught a struggling team, all of the sudden the other team catches fire. Or when they’d face a scuffling pitcher, all of the sudden he looks like Cy Young.

So while victories over a hot team are always satisfying, I’ll take the ones over a cold team any day.

by vince_ on May 23, 2008 8:47 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

I agree.

And a win tonight would be very tasty.

One game at a time.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 8:48 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, and Quentin does rule...

...from the Trib recap of the game:

Quentin is 7-for-14 with two out and runners in scoring position this season and is batting .417 overall (15-for-36) with runners in scoring position.

by vince_ on May 23, 2008 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Three more against the Tribe next week

Then a visit for four against the pesky Devil Rays. Let’s get another solid road trip!

C'mon, Smokey! This isn't 'Nam, it's bowling. There are rules!

by thekever on May 23, 2008 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

No Devil!

They are built in a similar mode as the Sox from a pitching standpoint, and their offense hasn’t been stellar. They have youth, speed, enthusiasm, decent “D”, and their best years are ahead of them.

Sox have pitching, power, enthusiasm (an 8 game win streak does wonders for esprit-de-corps), decent “D”, and as far as the future – Danks/Floyd/Q!/AR moving up. Old white guys, JD, staving off the inevitable.

Should be interesting. I look forward to dancing with them without it being effin’ Kiddie Day.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

My bad...

No DEVIL in Devil Rays anymore. I guess I have a Kangaroo Court appearance coming at Comiskey Park.

C'mon, Smokey! This isn't 'Nam, it's bowling. There are rules!

by thekever on May 23, 2008 10:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

they will always be the Devil Rays in my heart

with a storied history like theirs, you can’t turn your back on nostalgia. Just like Marquette basketball will always be the Warriors….

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 10:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, and wait 'til the lame asses on the north side

rename their stadium “Wrigley Field sponsored by Starbucks” or other such crapola…

"Still waking up in the mornings with shaking hands"

by thekever on May 23, 2008 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

8 game streaks

For some reason, that’s always been a magic number to me. Mostly because the 9th game is so elusive. Aside from the 4 streaks Cheat mentioned, in the last 30 yrs, the Sox had 8 gamers in 82, 83, 89, 90, 91, 95, 96, 00, and 03. But other than the one 9 gamer in 2006, you have to go back to 1977 for the next one. That’s like 2-14 in games following 8 wins. :)

So many times I can remember the Sox having their 8 game streak broken. In ‘06, when they won their 9th, I thought that it was going to be a special year (how more special? One more special.).

How bout it tonight? Let keep this goin!

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 8:58 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Great

and I’m going to tonights game.

by southsideirish on May 23, 2008 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Layers tonight, son.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah...

plus a few beers…plus an umbrella. traffic should be fun today

by southsideirish on May 23, 2008 9:52 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

The coffe is actually drinkable.

I had some last night.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

for some reason

I though Buehrle was pitching tonight originally, so I had figured I’d wouldn’t have to deal with the cold for too long. at least I’ll get to see how Gavin is doing it with smoke and mirrors up close and personal.

by southsideirish on May 23, 2008 9:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

brang home a win!

thats an action item for you.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 10:12 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Q makes this week's SI!

SI has crowned Q “for real” in this week’s article on MLB’s bizzaro season thus far.

In the same issue Legend was voted “the toughest guy in baseball” by 495 of his peers (see the SI poll).

"We're gonna bring it all day, everyday...we're gonna keep grinding it out." - Nick Swisher (4/1/08)

by tailgater on May 23, 2008 9:09 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

As Al Davis once said

“just win baby.”

Good pitching, timely hitting, aggressive base-running, opponents going through cold streaks, Super Q and Toby Hall hitting .351 – sounds like a winning combination to me.

Will it last? Probably not at the level experienced thus far, so they need to take advantage while they can, so hopefully they can overcome the rough spots down the road.

"We're gonna bring it all day, everyday...we're gonna keep grinding it out." - Nick Swisher (4/1/08)

by tailgater on May 23, 2008 9:13 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Dye average sneaking up

Living on the west coast I seldom can watch the games, but every time I go to the Box Scores it seems that Dye’s batting average keeps improving – This is a very good sign!

by phastphil on May 23, 2008 9:34 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Indeed..

Looks like he really did just need to get healthy. Makes me feel better about the long term too; can stick him at 1B or DH going forward.

by Grinder in Training on May 23, 2008 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dye is just SOLID.

He’s the consummate professional. When he went out in the outfield, after his 2nd homer on Wednesday, the fans down the line and in right field gave him a thundering ovation. He tipped his cap and then waved for a few seconds. He seems very humble Everything I’ve ever witnessed or heard about him indicates he’s a very decent human being. His parents should be very proud.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

take it easy bally

sounds like your daughter is marrying him!

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on May 23, 2008 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

(bally clutches heart, falls over)

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Vis-à-vis Sammy Sosa returning to RF.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

How 'bout bringing back W. Harris....

later this summer….currrently on the Nationals I think. Can play a bunch of different positions, add some speed, etc.

by stanchar on May 23, 2008 9:46 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Why would you want Willie Harris?

He’s a below average player that would make no impact on this team.

"You might be impressed with your analysis, but I am not. Stop wasting my time." - Chris De Luca

by BoKnows on May 23, 2008 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

stanchar, please do not just look at numbers like that in isolation

he was extraordinarily lucky last year.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:04 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

it's not 2005 anymore

look at his numbers. why was he useful? primarily because of his speed. he ain’t that fast anymore. he’s jason bourgeois that you have to trade for. and he plays positions that we already have depth at.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:03 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

fair enough....

by stanchar on May 23, 2008 10:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

if the white sox are to add to their bench

they need someone who can actually hit the ball. that’s what is missing. speed, multiple positions, bunting, whatever is all window dressing for the beat writers and knobheads listening to the score. a corner guy who can hit is what they require.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

If that's all they need

Then what are we worried about? We already have that.

by Grinder in Training on May 23, 2008 10:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

everything else that's far more important than the bench?

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Speaking of bunting,

I hope Cabrera is embarrassed enough of his performance last night “handling the bat,” that he’s out there as we post practicing “handling the bat.”

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 10:18 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i hope ozzie guillen is embarassed enough of his performance last night in calling for "handling of the bat," that he's out there as we post eliminating such sign from the sox vocabulary

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:20 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

just because we suck at bunting,

and have for a long time, doesn’t mean we shouldn’t keep trying. Just because there are many other ways to advance a runner by making an out (ways that might also “accidently” NOT make the out, or even score the guy), should not mean we give up on this quaint, holy remnant called the sacrifice. Because sacrifice is the ultimate team play, and we shall never relinquish its use, despite the fact it never works.

clearly.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

it doesn't exactly take a nuclear physicist to analyze cabrera's career numbers

and discern that sacrifice bunts are not exactly his forte.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

At least he didn't hit into a DP.

So take 2 strikes away by his unsuccessful sac. attmepts and you have a good thing. Then he really only has one swing to eff up the rally.

Just another reason to not have him lead off. You want your leadoff guy to be able to do some little things. ‘d rather go back to Swish at the top – at least he works the count.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 10:31 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

maybe ozzie could help his guys out

by perhaps surprising the other team by having someone not attempt to bunt in such scenarios like, say, once every 32 times. you know, change it up so the reliever doesn’t know that all he has to do is throw a high strike on the outside corner.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Or he could pinch-hit Buehrle

He’s looked better than anyone in that role.

Never trust a big butt and a smile.
Sox Machine

by Sox Machine on May 23, 2008 10:34 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

fuck that

javy. he’s the big bat off the bench, as far as i’m concerned. swing for the fences, son. he had an off year last year but i feel like he was unlucky and primed for a big rebound.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You just brought a smile to my face!

“fuck that”, “son” – Now we’re talking!

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.

by rhythm on May 23, 2008 11:55 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh man, that is true

he made it look easy. It certainly shouldn’t look as hard as most of the hitters make it look.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 10:39 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, that makes sense. ????!!!

The situation, where we were playing for a run to win it, didn’t dictate a bunt? Who the eff cares if it was a surprise or not? OC may not be a good bunter, but the situation made sense from a strategic standpoint. Don’t blame Ozzie for being predictable – I think even you might concur that he’s made a few good moves as of late and seems to be getting with the program (lineup order, defensive substitutions, handling of the pitching staff).

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 10:44 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

it's not an bad strategic decision in isolation

but, with this team and the way ozzie has acted in the past, it becomes less good. you can ask cabrera, i’m sure. scioscia would have done it differently.

by larry on May 23, 2008 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I dont buy that one Larry

I get what you are saying, but Ozzie has to have OC bunting there and he has to do a better job getting it down or taking the walk. He was easily a DP candidate and no way I want him swinging there. The way the bullpen was going and who was following play for the run all day there.

by Tdogg on May 23, 2008 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Come now

I think you are fishing. No offense, bottom 8, no outs and a man on 1st with your leadoff guy up. Too predictable? What’s Scioscia gonna have him do – fly out to the warning track like AJ did? Hit and run? Have BA steal? (Did you see him lumbering around 3rd on the Q hit? Damn near fell over.)

Jeez, your postulations are usually right on, but this seems like a stretch.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

sure, cabrera should be able to do a better job.

but i’ve seen that movie over and over and over. change it up. maybe you don’t do it in this particular situation but do it sometime. at least have the pitcher and the fielders thinking a bit. kobayashi has excellent control and command. cabrera was already behind the eightball because of that – he wasn’t going to get anything good to bunt. ozzie with his overall tactics sets up players who already aren’t great bunters for failure. and, big surprise, they failed again.

and, wow, a guy slipped going around third. boy, that will certainly enter into my thinking as to whether i want him stealing second. huh?

by larry on May 23, 2008 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He didn't just slip

He lumbered and almost fell because he didn’t cut the base properly.

What’s his SB success %, anyway?

And it ain’t Ozzie’s fault OC was up in that situation. Can’t pinch-hit for him. With Uribe hurt, who’s gonna play SS in the 9th? Alexei? Who plays 2nd? Toby’s already pinch-run for!

Let’s play chess here. Yeah, if it wasn’t a material inflection point in the game you don’t have OC bunt. But no one’s hitting, AJ/Q!, the hottest hitters are coming up, you try and move the runner over. Kaiser Souze wasn’t “on” last night anyway. Toby hit him, AJ nearly went yard, Q! and JD got hits, so he was not lights out. OrCa had a decent shot. Sometimes you have to rise to the occasion.

And who the hell CAN bunt on the Sox? What is Foxxie doing these days? Thought he was the answer for their bunting woes?

What would you have done? Hit and run, risking a pitchout or, more likely, a swing and a miss, and BA is toast?

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

his success rate is shitty

which is the reason not to have him steal instead of worrying about how he cuts a base, something which is wholly irrelevant for the former.

by larry on May 23, 2008 1:19 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

So what would you have done

with the limited options? (I was speaking of BA’s baserunning abilities in the main – I wasn’t suggesting he steal 2nd and third on the same throw. Be serious.)

You’re getting in a fight with everyone today. Go enjoy your weekend.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i always get into fights

but usually not over throw away comments like the one that set you on me. my point was a more general one – that ozzie should stop bunting all the friggin’ time because, when the obvious situations to use it arise, like yesterday, there isn’t even a question as to what ozzie is going to do: guy will be bunting on the first pitch and that’s the plan. and the indians had the exact sort of pitcher on the mound who would be able to best nullify ozzie’s obvious move.

hence “ozzie should delete the bunt sign from sox signs” or whatever i wrote.

by larry on May 23, 2008 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

But to the plebians like me

no line from you is a throwaway. We embrace your words as if they were foodstuffs in Bangaladesh. As if they were victories in the Detroit Tigers first quarter. As if wounded, vulnerable, financially strapped companies being helped by hedge funds.

You know, rare, precious gifts.

;)

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

you know who could lay down a perfect bunt, feisty?

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on May 23, 2008 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe we should start calling him "Zay"

The way Hawk makes my head spin (and not in a good way), it’ll probably come out Yaz anyway.

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 23, 2008 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Neither bunt was even close.

WAFJ.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bring back Gload!

by madvillian on May 23, 2008 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

does he play leadoff?

by southsideirish on May 23, 2008 9:56 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Play?????????

He excels.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Contreras 2.0

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/contreras-20

My guess? 44

by Tdogg on May 23, 2008 10:05 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Cuban pride is worth about -5 yrs

He not going to let himself get embarrassed by being old.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Update...

on the great struggle -

(I have no idea why I find this fascinating, I just do).

EQA -

Orlando Cabrera – .204
Juan Uribe – .204
Alexei Ramirez – .190

OPS+ -

Orlando Cabrera – 53
Juan Uribe – 59
Alexei Ramirez – 48

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 23, 2008 10:22 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

jerry, if you're going to appropriate my ideas, at least use the appropriate name for it.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:25 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Forgive me...

it’s still early here.

What’s the proper name again?

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 23, 2008 10:26 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

deathmatch

and, since you find it so fascinating, it’s all yours.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:27 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's right.

I’ll take good care of her.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on May 23, 2008 10:29 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Should keep a baseline up there.

So we can see how far they’ve moved up.. or fallen off in the last few weeks.

by Grinder in Training on May 23, 2008 10:33 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

baselines don't matter

this is mano a mano a mano.

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:36 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

A Latin American Standoff

So to speak…

"I'll bring the awesome." -The 'Swish'

by Hazymania on May 23, 2008 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Toby!

So did he drink the kool-aid before the game or what?! My boy was 3-3 and should have thrown out a runner if Cabrera doesn’t get cute with the ball.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 23, 2008 10:39 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

kool-aid = PED?

by larry on May 23, 2008 10:43 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Something

He didn’t look like the old Toby…I doubt it was ‘roids or HGH or anything like that. Maybe a case of red bull or some amphetamines? Tobster was totally energized! He was bouncing around the back of the plate like a little kid. He didn’t look like the old lathargec Toby I remember.

I could say something about a sugar rush, twinkies, etc. – but I won’t!

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 23, 2008 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just happy to be playing, perhaps,

and feeling more confident.

Nah.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

and maybe not feeling injured

feeling like you’re capable can do wonders.

by larry on May 23, 2008 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well,

it sure looked like it. I guess his shoulder injury looks like something he has gotten over. That throw to second was a rifle.

Maybe Fisk said something to him before the game….because he looked un-Toby like.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 23, 2008 11:06 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

You thought it was a rifle?

He wound up like Satchel Paige. And it sailed. I’m not generalizing from one throw, but it wasn’t on the bag. It beat the runner substantially because it looked as if he got a miserable jump.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes

That ball got there in a hurry. Not sure about the job, it may have been a bad one…but he got the ball to second quickly even with the ball sailing. Cabrera should have made that play. I don’t care if he is winding up like Bruce Sutter to throw it, as long as he beats the runner.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 23, 2008 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

job=jump

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on May 23, 2008 11:28 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

A lot of testiness from fans of an 8-straight winner.

Such is life.

I’m kind of enjoying the symetry of the standings: 3 1/2, 4 1/2, 5 1/2, and 6 1/2 games back.

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 23, 2008 11:41 AM CDT reply actions 0 recs

seems like the regular amount to me

you’re never as good as you are when you’re hot. and you’re never as bad as you are when you’re not.

by larry on May 23, 2008 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jerry Reed you ain't

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

but Hawk is

when you hot, YOU HOT!

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm not sure why,

but I found that hysterical.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm sure it's a lot testier over at the Cleveland board.

by Grinder in Training on May 23, 2008 11:57 AM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah!

suck on THAT, Drew Carey! Who rocks NOW??

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on May 23, 2008 12:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Strippers!

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:43 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Top 5

Along with flubs.

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=7567

by Tdogg on May 23, 2008 12:16 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Cubs' Soto hasn't gotten much press.

Soriano
Fukudome
Zambrano
Kerry Wood
Piniella

Rookie, catcher Soto:

.314 /.414 /.601 /1.016

Like WOW.

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 12:38 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

he good. he real good.

by larry on May 23, 2008 12:40 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

But can he beat AJ in a fist fight?

"We're gonna bring it all day, everyday...we're gonna keep grinding it out." - Nick Swisher (4/1/08)

by tailgater on May 23, 2008 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

any idea why did he spent 3 years in AAA?

I don’t get it

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on May 23, 2008 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

because he bad then. real bad.

by larry on May 23, 2008 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Soto was THE guy I wanted in fantasy

and I made more than a few trade proposals last year that involved him coming here, iirc.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on May 23, 2008 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Soto

He had a 785 OPS in seven minor league season. Before he put up a 1076 OPS at Iowa last year, he had never attained an OPS before 756. Before his .652 slugging percentage at Iowa last year, his career high in that category was .417. Before 2007, he was an average to below average hitter, and now he’s Mike Piazza in his prime at the plate. He’s as obvious an HGH user as we have in baseball right now, unless a guy randomly gains hundreds of points of power in his mid 20’s out of nowhere.

The south will rise again...

by whitesoxfan101 on May 23, 2008 12:59 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

yup. clearly. thanks for the insight.

by larry on May 23, 2008 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

He's nobody from nowhere. He's a joke.

Did you ever think he was shot by a goldigger when he was 16 on his way to a baseball tryout with the Yankees, laid in a hospital for 2 years, and thus lost his confidence? Kinda got sidetracked? And now is making a comeback in the klieg lights of Chicago media?

I think we have 2 lives. The one we learn with, and the one we live with after that. And you, sir, obviously are still living your first life. That is what is obvious.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

although he did write something that made me smile earlier:

Q-dini (in reference to Q!).

Not bad.

We shall reach greater and greater platitudes of achievment.

by Chiburb on May 23, 2008 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hitler liked dogs.

Everyone has strengths.

I took the "under".

by winningugly on May 23, 2008 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Me too.

I like Q-dini.

Maybe Q!-dini?

Pitching, defense and health.

by ballyb on May 23, 2008 2:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes. my bad. Hey Bally, as long as you're here:

Did you notice how the Merc folks brought their bums with them to this side of town? Combined with ours, it’s almost impossible to walk down Jackson, Adams, or Van Buren.
And I’m noticing a lower class on LaSalle too.

When she farts, a little rainbow comes out...

by Chiburb on May 23, 2008 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs