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White Sox in a Giving Mood

Thecheatsmoking_tiny by The Cheat on in Recaps

I suppose when you win 7 straight, when your playoff hopes are as high as ever, when you're facing a team you've dominated recently, you're bound to get a little cocky. That was Tuesday's loss to the Tigers.

The White Sox seemed to think they could get away with giving away outs, with poor baserunning decisions, with leaving an ineffective starter in the game to give up some much needed insurance runs. They couldn't.

Jose Contreras was terrible--2007-esque--and I've got pretty graphs to prove it. Contreras was a couple MPH slower with his fastball according to gameday, and while he walked only one, his control withing the strike zone was, let's say, lacking.

A week ago, when there were calls for Ozzie Guillen's head following his Tampa Tirade, I wrote "Guillen has been superb through the first 55 games. He hasn't made a single egregious in-game tactical error large enough for me to even note in any of my recaps.

Well, it was a nice run. I knew it couldn't last for an entire season.

Contreras allowed 5 runs on 8 hits in the 4th through 6th innings, with two of the outs he recorded being handed to him (a bunt, and an overrun of first on a run-scoring play). In the top of the 7th, the offense scratched across a run against Nate Robertson and the Tigers' pen to put them back within 2. Yet there was Ozzie, despite the diminished velocity, despite the brutal last three innings, sending Contreras back out there for the 7th inning. Add in a sacrifice bunt and a couple of Not-Even-Close steal attempts, and this was easily Ozzie's worst game of the year.

Not even the generally cautious (at least so far) Jeff Cox could escape the out giveaways. He waved Carlos Quentin, who stutter stepped as he passed third base, home from second on a hard hit single right at left fielder Brent Clevlen. It was immediately obvious to anyone watching at home--I assume that's why Quentin stuttered--that Q! would be toast at the plate with anything other than a Podsednik-Damon-Pierre arm in left. He was, and he took the Sox hopes of an 8th inning comeback with him.

Here's a quick guide to all the free outs handed out by the Sox on the night

Free Outs

Inning outs Player Free Out
1 0 AJ Pierzynski Sacrifice bunt
1 1 Orlando Cabrera Caught Stealing (3rd)
3 2 AJ Pierzynski Caught advancing on throw
5 2 Alexei Ramirez Caught Stealing (2nd)
8 1 Carlos Quentin Thrown out at home

The Sox may be a good team, but they're not good enough to spot any team 5 outs and a poor pitching performance.

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Pitching matchups not good....

It’s unfortunate that the Sox gave this game away, because both the resurgent Verlander and Rogers are bad matchups for the Sox (what with Verlander being talented and Rogers being left handed).

I’ll be happy if the Sox take one of the next 2 games.

by hitlesswonder on Jun 11, 2008 12:04 AM CDT   0 recs

It's funny

I had anything less than 7-2 stretch, 6-3 maybe, as being a failure in my mind…

Then I saw the pitching matchups for the Dtroit series. Yeah. They’re not great. Gonna be a lot tougher than I thought.

AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on Jun 11, 2008 12:07 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Matchups, smatchups -

We’ve owned DET for the last 3 years, IIRC. And Rogers/Verlander have been solved before. One loss and folks are hedging? Man up.

If anything, winning on the road, for some reason, is impossible this year for almost all teams. THAT’S the angle to approach this from (Jayson Stark on ESPN.com lists Reason #1: “No Greenies.”).

CWS: Slashing negative expectations since May, 2008.

by winningugly on Jun 11, 2008 8:28 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

damn right!

we own verlander dammit

and rogers’ best days are over

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 12:16 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Konerko is the only one clueless against Verlander (.347 OPS in 24 ABs)

Between Thome, Dye, AJ, and Swisher, they have 16 HRs off Verlander in 98 ABs

by 3E8 on Jun 11, 2008 12:46 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

typo

14 HRs

by 3E8 on Jun 11, 2008 12:47 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Sox are 11-8 vs lefties

Show mercy. I get to watch the Rangers.

by Tim from Texas on Jun 11, 2008 1:40 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Those graphs you put up were great

They really showed just how asleep at the wheel Ozzie has been with Count. Ozzie needs to realize this isn’t some 26 year old out there and get him out of the game when he’s clearly tiring. His velocity was way down, get him out!

by madvillian on Jun 11, 2008 12:28 AM CDT   0 recs

Pitching to Cabrera

with men on 2nd and 3rd and 2 outs with some yocum in the on deck circle who had 23 MLB at bats.

Ozzie & Co. must have spent yesterday afternoon perusing the insightful SSS discussions noting how the division was theirs and that the other contenders, with the possible exception of the Indians, were “cooked.”

Pitching, defense, health and 10 or more runs a game

by ballyb on Jun 11, 2008 12:33 AM CDT   0 recs

On the radio broadcast

Steve Stone was equally puzzled by the fact that the Sox pitched to Cabrera in that situation (and I believe he said so before the hit).

by palehose67 on Jun 11, 2008 9:03 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

clearly

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 9:39 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Had to say I was surprised

Everytime the Sox attempted to mount a rally, they just got snuffed out…and it was odd even though that was exactly they were doing a little over a week ago.

Didn’t Pierzynski’s base running gaffe allow Ramirez to score?

Rusty Longley v 2.0

by Ozzie Montana on Jun 11, 2008 12:34 AM CDT   0 recs

No

I thought it would have been close at the plate given a perfect throw (but others have said no that were watching on more than MLB.tv windowed view), but apparently it wasn’t close enough to where AJ should have been thinking anything but making a hard turn and going back to 1st.

So yea: Ramirez would have scored cut or no cut.

by madvillian on Jun 11, 2008 12:36 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Did anyone hear Hawk and D.J. commenting a few games ago...

about how the Sox baserunning has been the best they have seen in a long time because they are so aggressive? I laughed at the comment then and I am still laughing about it now. For all the shit that Joey Cora got when he was the Third Base Coach, Jeff Cox is even worse. This team runs into the most obvious outs that you will ever see and Orlando Cabrera is leading the charge. Cabrera is hitting well now but like Podsednik, you almost have to dock points off of his OBP for running into so many stupid outs. I guess it made some sense to try for the extra base when they weren’t hitting at all but now that the offense seems to be racking up double-digit hits each game, they should be more conservative.

by SSH2005 on Jun 11, 2008 3:02 AM CDT   0 recs

Out stealing 3rd with Q! at bat

Really anserine, dopy, dopey, foolish, goosey, goosy, gooselike, jerkyblockheaded, boneheaded, duncical, duncish, fatheaded, loggerheaded, thick, thickheaded, thick-skulled, wooden-headedcloddish, doltishdense, dim, dull, dumb, obtuse, slowgaumless, gormlesslumpish, lumpen, unthinkingnitwitted, senseless, soft-witted, witlessweak.

Pitching, defense, health and 10 or more runs a game

by ballyb on Jun 11, 2008 6:37 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Clearly it was slowgaumless and jerkyblockheaded,

and maybe it was lumpen, but c’mon, there’s no way that was gormlesslumpish. Man, the hyperbole on this site sometimes …

If I were a believer in such things, I would say that just handing a game away like last night against a team that looks very good on paper but has apparently been asleep most of the year is bad karma. Thankfully, we sophisticated fans on this site do not believe in such things.

Right? RIGHT?!

/ hides under covers.

by The Actual El Guapo on Jun 11, 2008 11:13 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

DJ, you know who was never gormlessslumpish?

thats right, Yaz was so full of gorm, he wrote the book.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on Jun 11, 2008 11:21 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I never understood what was Razor Shines' sin...

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 12:22 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Not one of Ozzie's finest moments

The AJ sac was really bad. Why? Hottest offense in baseball and you play for 1 run in the first? Consistently taking the bat out of the team hands. There was no reason to get cute.

Maybe he felt he wanted Count to get over some head games with Detroit but for what? He didnt have his A stuff.

The one positive is the bats still looked hot.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Jun 11, 2008 8:22 AM CDT   0 recs

Contreras lost the game

Sure the baserunning wasn’t too good – but it came down to Contreras and velocity and control were both off. I can accept it every once in a while…lets get em tonight.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Jun 11, 2008 8:30 AM CDT   0 recs

saw this -- made me gulp

According to “Inside Edge,” Jim Thome is hitting just .098 (5-for-51) this season off of curveballs and sliders. Normally it’s the fastball that gets to aging hitters, but in this case, it appears to be the breaking stuff

by RoyEgan on Jun 11, 2008 9:02 AM CDT   0 recs

Wasn't this posted earlier?

And his HR was off a breaking pitch last night?

Let’s keep it fresh, men. Like patton – don’t need to pay for the same real estate twice.

CWS: Slashing negative expectations since May, 2008.

by winningugly on Jun 11, 2008 9:19 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Hopefully, he is coming around...

But he has struck out against a lot of righties this season, which isn’t good.

by SSH2005 on Jun 11, 2008 9:30 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

In case you were wondering...

Here’s Thome’s swinging strikes against curves

Bit of a pattern there, I believe.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 11, 2008 3:55 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I like aggressive base running

but, I think there is a fine line between aggressive and risky. As of late the Sox have crossed the line over to risky.

by phastphil on Jun 11, 2008 9:20 AM CDT   0 recs

Uribe's trade value...

Ken Rosenthal wrote:

The Dodgers, before obtaining shortstop Angel Berroa, attempted to acquire White Sox infielder Juan Uribe in a deal for Esteban Loaiza, major-league sources say. The Dodgers offered to split the difference between Loaiza’s contract and Uribe’s, but the White Sox balked and signed Loaiza for the pro-rated minimum after the Dodgers released him — a move that also enabled them to retain Uribe as a trade chip. The White Sox could move either Uribe or Pablo Ozuna and add a reserve outfielder now that Alexei Ramirez has taken over at second base . . .

Dump Ozuna or Uribe and sign Lofton.

by SSH2005 on Jun 11, 2008 9:57 AM CDT   0 recs

ignore reality, of course

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 10:00 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

If... and that's a big if

Wouldn’t it be better (if you could get rid of one of them) – to bring up Fields and use him at 3rd as a backup and platoon the DH role. Why this love still for Lofton – we have a 4th outfielder for defense. (Though at 40 he had a great BA and OBP – still, he hasn’t played since last season)

by Brush Back on Jun 11, 2008 10:08 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

or that kenny lofton wants to sit on the bench

so it’s all academic.

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 10:17 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

ding, ding, ding!

I think I read somewhere the same, maybe MLBTR

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 12:24 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I just don't see Lofton coming here

He wouldn’t have much oppurtunity as the 5th outfielder, and if Ozuna is dumped it probably means the Sox need another infielder—not that Ozuna is any good but at least he can play a semi passable 2nd and 3rd. I ‘d still like to see Ozuna dumped for Fields right around the All-Star game. Should have plenty of time to get regular at bats in AAA before then.

by madvillian on Jun 11, 2008 10:19 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

for all the double switches, of course.

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 10:30 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Which is why Uribe shouldn't be dumped

I don’t see how anyone can advocate for dumping Uribe now that he’s on the bench. He’s above average defensively at 3 infield positions and has some power. He’s a below average starter but an excellent bench player.

by hitlesswonder on Jun 11, 2008 10:36 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

he's fat

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 10:38 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

plus, Uribe never even gets off the bench

cant complain about a guy that doesn’t play, and isn’t blocking anyone else who’s better. He obviously doesnt have any trade value, so we’re stuck with him. Luckily, he’ll contribute a little bit.

The more we look like a playoff team, the more happy I am that we have him. He’s at least a Geoff Blum (a “Blum-and-a-half” <——fat joke here) minus the LH bat.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on Jun 11, 2008 11:26 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Eh

Just seems having another IF is better than having a 5th outfielder, although it’s not like Fields would be a defensive replacement for anyone—but having Fields to spell Crede every once and than is better than having Ozuna or Uribe to give him teh day off.

Basically I just think Fields is more likely to contribute usefully than Lofton.

by madvillian on Jun 11, 2008 11:08 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Fields would make a lot of sense...

DH versus lefties, backup 3B, and even emergency LF’er. Not sure why they haven’t made the move yet. Ozuna is awful.

by SSH2005 on Jun 11, 2008 11:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i'm not reallly sure the defensive position(s) of a backup player matters much

if you already have more than adequate defensive replacements in place, which the sox do in BA and uribe (and obviously one needs a catcher, too). constructing a roster around “losing” 2 of your 3 non-1B infielders in a single game seems rather frivolous. it’s what those other players bring to the offensive side that matters at such a point. so pick whatever kind of contribution you want from that perpective.

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 11:22 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Yea, agreed, sox have enough players

capable of playing multible positions adequatly, focus should probably be on not bringing the suck at the plate.

by madvillian on Jun 11, 2008 11:27 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

catcher?

you mean 3rd string? I thought juanito could catch too…

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 12:28 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

How sad is this?

An actual post from an actual member of Bless You Boys (SNB sister of SSS):

“Last nights game was very entertaining… more so then any game this year. It gives me hope for this team yet.”

I don’t care about the hope part, but can you imagine last night’s game being the most entertaining after 40% of the season? Just how bad has it been in Detroit?

When she farts, a little rainbow comes out...

by Chiburb on Jun 11, 2008 11:22 AM CDT   0 recs

SBN, not SNB

When she farts, a little rainbow comes out...

by Chiburb on Jun 11, 2008 11:23 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i think Dontrelle's pitching

has been way more entertaining. Its hard to suck that bad.

Maggs’ hair has entertainment value too.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on Jun 11, 2008 11:32 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

on a side note...

...i had a debate with a friend who claims that the Cell is not a hitter friendly park.

Where can i get information related to the amount of home runs hit for each respective ballpark? Say the last 7-8 years or so?

Thanks.

by The Scoper on Jun 11, 2008 12:07 PM CDT   0 recs

It would prob. be easier

just to watch a few games at the cell? How does he not realize this?

by 815Sox on Jun 11, 2008 12:15 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

he is a moron

a cub fan from north dakota who apparently does not know anything about baseball

but to his credit, it may not be as apparent to someone on the west coast who thinks chicago baseball only involves harry carry, wrigley, and the cubs that the cell is a launching pad

by The Scoper on Jun 11, 2008 12:17 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

True True

I guess it shouldn’t be surprising that Cubs fans exist in North Dakota. They are everywhere… damn WGN.

by 815Sox on Jun 11, 2008 1:44 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

baseball reference has park factors, iirc

but so does BP, as does firstinning.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 11, 2008 3:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

thanks

the stat that explains it is Home Run Park Factor (HRPF)

by The Scoper on Jun 11, 2008 4:38 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

if detroit has a fire sale this summer

would they put a ‘for sale’ sign on polanco? I don’t see why not

would/should kenny be interested?

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 12:33 PM CDT   0 recs

brainfart

we have the cuban missile for this year
and richar for next year when the missile moves over…

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 2:18 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

14 teams interested in Dayan Viciedo

says the Reds beat writer

I assume the Media Blancas are interested…

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 1:20 PM CDT   0 recs

the Torpedo Boat speaks
Juan Uribe hasn’t started a game since May 15 and hasn’t played since May 31.

Despite his lack of activity and a potential trade market for middle infielders, Uribe said Tuesday he would like to stay with the White Sox.

“I like the team,” Uribe said. “I like Chicago. I love the fans and the city too. I’m here to play. I’m ready. I’m comfortable.”

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-080610-juan-uribe-chicago-white-sox,1,5607337.story


translation: the food here is good, Ozzie too…

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 1:23 PM CDT   0 recs

LOL

“Pass the guacamole!” (Burp.)

No hunger goes unsatiated for Juanito.

CWS: Slashing negative expectations since May, 2008.

by winningugly on Jun 11, 2008 1:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Uribe Inconsistent

You just don’t know what your going to at the plate or in the field from one game to the next.
Hey! What’s wrong with food? Besides, Chicago has some of the best food in the country.

by phastphil on Jun 11, 2008 2:03 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Hey! What’s wrong with food?

nothing’s wrong

Besides, Chicago has some of the best food in the country.

hell yes!

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 11, 2008 2:37 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

he's comfortable

even though he’s not playing. And that attitude kind of shows when he is playing. And he doesn’t seem to care that he lost his job.

I basically like Uribe, and he’s got a role on the team. But I find it very conflicting that Cabrera gets ripped up and down for not being a team player, when Uribe gets a pass despite being Mr Complacent.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on Jun 11, 2008 3:25 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

is that you, de luca?

way to read whatever you want into those quotes.

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 3:31 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

indeed

that’s what reading is

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on Jun 11, 2008 3:37 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

let me know what school it is where you learned comfortable and complacent are synonymous

so i don’t send my kids there.

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 3:39 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Wouldn't be a weekday if someone wasn't getting BA'ed

over linguistics on this site. Save it for the Tiggers, men.

CWS: Slashing negative expectations since May, 2008.

by winningugly on Jun 11, 2008 3:44 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

or someone laying a hatchet job on a sox player over something as innocuous as the above.

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 3:45 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I have to say, I was pretty amused by the Juan comment

First thing I thought of was a paycheck sort of thing, and I like ‘em PO’ed that they aren’t playing. You have to admit, ifthere would be any member of the team just happy to be collecting a paycheck for showing up, it’d be Juan. Not that he is, mind you, but the perception isn’t otherworldly, is it?

“Hatchet” is a little strong when nuance is involved, don’t you think? The “fat” jokes come from somewhere.

CWS: Slashing negative expectations since May, 2008.

by winningugly on Jun 11, 2008 3:53 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

it's not nuance

it’s “let me fill in the blanks with what i want.” first of all, we have mark gonzalez asking a question, presumably within the context of other questions or conversation, which we don’t know. second, we have mark gonzalez translating from spanish to english uribe’s answer. finally, we have nordhagen then filling in the rest with what he wants.

it's time to accept that we're powerless when it comes to the white sox and turn ourselves over to a higher power: KW

by larry on Jun 11, 2008 3:58 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

cmon, its not a hatchet job

its not that serious. I understand it was just a personal piece on how Uribe is taking his new bench role. Some guys get really pissed about it. Juan didnt.

Mosi Tatupu! Mosi Tatupu!

by Nordhagen on Jun 11, 2008 3:56 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs