Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Knicks 90, Raptors 87: "Shump and Lin wouldn't let us lose."

In the Mouth a Desert: A Sad Sad Look Into '08 White Sox Pitching Prospects

Having already braved the barrens in order to examine White Sox hitting prospects, I was forced to take some time off to recover from the exhausting mental expedition.  Once again rested, I knew it would only be a matter of time before I felt compelled to finish the job.  Thus follows my report on White Sox pitching prospects in Aught Eight.

Oh, another note.  I found that batted ball breakdown by level from FI that I'd been pining for.  It looks like this:

      GB   LD   OF   IF BUNT
A- 51% 14% 25% 8% 1%
A 49% 14% 28% 8% 1%
A+ 48% 14% 29% 8% 1%
AA 46% 15% 29% 8% 1%
AAA 46% 18% 28% 7% 1%
MLB 44% 19% 30% 6% 1%

The takeaway is that conceding a batted ball is far less damaging in the minors than in the majors because it's much easier to achieve a ground ball and avoid line drives.  It also means we're looking for really superlative GB rates rather than anything above 50%.

Star-divide

Kannapolis

  • The Rest - Perhaps somewhat harsh, but it's probably easier to talk about Kanny as a staff.  There are no standouts (Anthony Carter received a promotion to Winston Salem and will be discussed there), but there are some intriguing arms.  First, it's interesting to note that the staff has averaged 9.24 K/9 compared to a 7.82 league wide average.  K rates look to be inflated across the board to some extent, but Kanny is still leading the way despite lacking in bona fide prospects.  My personal favorite is Nathan Jones.  When not K'ing 10+ per 9, he's allowing a .925 OPS against.  He was drafted in the 5th round last year and is part of a trio of early-ish round picks from that draft that ended up in Kanny this year along with Leroy Hunt and Johnnie Lowe (currently on the 7 day DL).  Another potentially interesting name is Jason Rice.  He's 22 and was drafted in the 11th round of the 2005 draft.  He's been moved back and forth between starting and relieving and couldn't stick in W-S as a reliever last year, but he has posted nice K rates consistently.  At 6'0'' we're likely talking about a max effort type delivery if he's got legitimate stuff.  I assume that his W-S promotion was an effort to see if he could move quickly as a reliever.  Now he's filler unless he can bring his walk rate around.

Winston-Salem

  • Anthony Carter - His first start as a Warthog went terribly, but his Kanny stats certainly warranted a promotion.  He was second in the SAL in K/BF according to firstinning at 27.8% through 61 2/3 IP.  For context, DLS managed 31.8% in 97 2/3 IP.  Like Nathan Jones, then, he's got a near-dominant K rate.  The difference is in control.  Carter gave up just 11 free passes, good for a K/BB ratio of 6.  This is likely Carter's ticket going forward, since I doubt he's got the stuff to maintain those K rates.  He was a 26th rounder in 2005 and was no where near as dominant in Bristol and Great Falls.  Absent a scouting report and in light of uninspiring GB rates, I'm not going to give him the benefit of the doubt given his pedigree.
  • John Ely - Last year's 3rd round pick out of Miami-Ohio, Ely is a polished right hander who does everything pretty well.  Gets a solid number of ground balls (48%), decent K rate (22%) and is good about avoiding walks (6.5%).  According to a blurb I got from BP, Goldstein thinks he's got "good stuff" with rough mechanics, so this kind of early success bodes well, particularly the low walk rates.  The fact that this kind of pitcher is available in the 3rd round really gives the lie to the McCulloch-Broadway theory of drafting.
  • The Rest - No one especially notable.  Somewhat infamous spare parts Michael Dubee and Jacob Rasner are doing well enough and closer Kanekoa Texeira is getting a good number of grounders, though I wish his K rate was in the 9+ per game range.  This isn't a very good pitching staff, sadly.

Birmingham

  • Aaron Poreda - The other recent promotion and by far more notable.  Until Beckham signs, Poreda is our top prospect and one of the very few with a major league fastball in the entire system.  That and his left handedness probably guarantees a major league career of some kind (barring injury of course).  In fact, judging by his splits, he could probably already be a LOOGY. He got 73 1/3 IP in Winston Salem and demonstrated good control and kept his H/9 below 9.  The bigger questions are how many ground balls will he get and how many strikeouts?  His K rate was below average for the league and 55% of batted balls stayed on the ground.  Personally, I think that's a bit underwhelming for a guy who is living off his fastball at the moment.  He may struggle in AA if his secondary stuff is as lackluster as the poor K rate suggests.  On the other hand, it's clear that Kenny thinks very highly of Poreda.  He's not afraid of exposing him to levels Aaron may or may not be ready for and, as opposed to leaving Gio in AA for the entire year to dominate and grow his stock, the White Sox have made a commitment to getting him to the big league club.  Kenny is either completely certain that he won't struggle or doesn't mind letting the rest of the league see him do so.  Either way, it gives me faith beyond the numbers that Poreda will do well in the long run.
  • The Rest - Cheat fave Lucas Harrell has only thrown 13 IP so far with 9 K to 1 BB.  Recovering from shoulder surgery is a tall order, so here's hoping.  JRE likes Carlos Torres, so I'll give him a blurb.  He repeated W-S and is now repeating Birmingham.  If KW liked him at all, he'd be in Charlotte.  Whatever he's got, it looks like no one thinks it'll play at a major league level.  Justin Cassel is a personal favorite of mine.  He was lighting up W-S with a 65% GB rate until he was shut down for the year.  He's only at 56% in B-ham and is walking too many and K'ing too few.  Is it too harsh to presume Kyle McCulloch isn't a prospect?  His peripherals are right in line with Cassel's and McCulloch already had 26 1/3 IP in B-ham last year though he is 6 months younger.  Brian Omogrosso has imploded so far this year despite being put on Goldstein's Top 11 White Sox Prospects.  In sum, Birmingham is almost entirely bereft of talent.  Ugh

Charlotte

  • Clayton Richard - Somewhat old (Sept '83 DOB) and somewhat boring, he's still a tall lefty (6'5'' 225 lbs) who can get ground balls.  Somewhat underwhelming pedigree, too, as he's from Michigan and was drafted in the 8th round back in '05 after a single season of baseball and came to Michigan as a QB recruit in the same class as Chad Henne.  This year, he's demonstrated even better control, getting his BB/PA just under 5% and has bumped his K rate from 14.5% of batters faced to 16.2%.  Like I said, he's somewhat boring.  But I'll take 52% GB rate from a lefty, particularly one who's held righties to a .219/.256/.330 line.  He's a pretty decent 5th starter candidate who will probably be in Charlotte by the end of the year. **EDIT** Larry informs me Richard just got promoted and is starting tonight in Charlotte.  So I cut/pasted him down to Charlotte.
  • Jack Egbert - Perhaps the reason Poreda is getting the call.  Prior to his injury and subsequent struggles, he was who we'd launch on alert 5 if Floyd or Contreras implode.  Give him time and hopefully he repairs his GB and BB rates.  They aren't way off, but those were the primary factors in his success up to this point.  Pitching to contact is a careful balance and extra base runners and line drives upset the balance significantly.  K's, from this writer's perspective, are gravy.  We should probably push somebody out of Charlotte's rotation so Richard can move up, frankly. 
  • Lance Broadway - It's a little hard to afford him prospect status when I denied McCulloch, but the scouting reports on his secondary offerings are good and I've not heard similarly of McCulloch.  I've been trying to assume the worst given the information I've got, so confirmation of a 60 curve and a 55 change is actually pretty heartening.  If moving to the pen gets his heat an extra notch or two, he's certainly as good as Nick Masset.  It'd also be nice if he could cut his walk rate a bit considering how much contact he allows. 
  • The Rest - Adam Russell is getting grounders but needs to halve his walk rate.  Resident knuckleballer Charlie Haeger would do well to do the same, but controlling the knuckler is the essence of the problem.  He's going to be gone before he becomes effective, isn't he?  Too bad.  Here's a fun fact: not half of the pitchers who have appeared in a game for Charlotte are under 30.

On the whole, it's just as sad as the hitting prospects, though at least here there is a caveat, namely the Swisher trade.  Nonetheless for a team with such a poor connection to Latin America to have consistently performed so badly in the draft from 2003-2006 explains much about 2007 and our dire outlook prior to KW's wheeling and dealing.  We really ought to laud Kenny for the squad he's forged this year.  Danks, Floyd, Ramirez, Quentin and Swisher were all unexpectedly acquired and Floyd, Ramirez and Quentin have definitely outperformed their projections.  Add to that Poreda, Egbert, Fields and Beckham and that isn't a bad bunch of 27 and unders.

Comment 46 comments  |  2 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

let's stay on top of things, colin

richard is at charlotte now. christ. the quality on this site has sure gone down with all these “contributing” authors.

by larry on Jun 12, 2008 4:59 PM CDT reply actions  

shit, when did that happen?

well it almost sorta speaks well of me right?

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

i woke up, watched us lose and started writing

i’m behind on the fanposts.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

weeping

nobody appreciates what i do. it wouldn’t matter if i just went away like chicagopete did, would it? goodbye world!

by larry on Jun 12, 2008 5:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

well i miss Pete

dn if i’d miss you larry. one fewer lawyer?

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

[Whispering to everyone but Larry]

Guys, don’t say anything, but I ordered Larry a WebKinz (http://www.webkinz.com/us_en/) earlier today—it should arrive via FedEx tomorrow. He’s been feeling a bit unappreciated lately, and thought he could use a pick-me-up. It comes with a free box of gummy bears.

I was torn between the Darrin Erstad mutt (“Dirtbag”) and the Carlos Quentin purebred Scottish Terrier (“Socrates”), so I split the difference and went with the Carl Everett dinosaur (“Non-Existy”).

Shhhh—don’t say anything!

by The Actual El Guapo on Jun 12, 2008 5:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Great post, AEG.

Quit capitalizing his name, though. If he don’t make the effort, you don’t.

CWS: Slashing negative expectations since May, 2008.

by winningugly on Jun 12, 2008 7:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

he was the third piece of the Carter-Poreda-??? cascade, presumably.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

by the way

for future reference, you may want to use that “continue reading…” option when you do a long post like this. scrolling down to click on the comments link may get annoying.

by larry on Jun 12, 2008 5:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

i was doing that on earlier posts, but decided to follow Cheat's lead

see what i did there? lede/lead????!

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

so, how can the quality go back up?

perharps another contributing author?

The greatest trick the White Sox ever pulled was convincing their fan base that "Ozzieball" ever existed.

by The Wizard on Jun 12, 2008 7:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

since he's apparently the item of the day

Richard has gone 7, 7, 9 and 8.2 IP in his last 4 starts.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:05 PM CDT reply actions  

fixed

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm pretty sure Richard was my "breakout' candidate last year

though it could have been the year before…

It’s hard to believe he suddenly found a way to cut his hit rate so drastically… but he /does/ have a good sinker apparently (check GB rates last two seasons) and was a late to baseball guy, as he was focused more on football in HS and college.

AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on Jun 12, 2008 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

yeah it looks like he didn't even pitch the year previous to the one he got drafted

so there was probably a lot of development left in him. it helps that he’s got like zero mileage on his arm, too. i think the walk rates are really encouraging for a guy who hasn’t had a lot of baseball.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Who is the worse longman / spot starter -- Loaiza or Weaver?
Brewers released RHP Jeff Weaver from Triple-A Nashville.
As per his contract, Weaver requested the move after learning he wouldn’t be called up. He was 2-4 with a 6.22 ERA in nine starts for Nashville.

by SSH2005 on Jun 12, 2008 5:14 PM CDT reply actions  

who cares?

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

i just don't understand your fascination with the utterly trivial

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Utterly trivial?

Like half of these pathetic prospects that you wrote paragraphs about who will likely never even sniff the majors?

Hmmm…

by SSH2005 on Jun 12, 2008 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

i don't get worked up about it

and therein lies the difference. i had fun. you bitch and moan.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

i have always read an "of" when it wasn't there?

the things you learn about yourself.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

the last one went a lot better

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

honestly though i'd rather be corrected than go on being wrong

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

beat me to it

nice job on another reference that reminds me of discovering indie rock in high school, though, colin. you clearly had awesome taste when you were like 4. i’m expecting superchunk, archers of loaf, or slint next. get crackin’.

by Ryno on Jun 12, 2008 5:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

i'm just obsessive about my hobbies

it’s also a lot easier to find the good stuff from the past than the good stuff from now.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

best thing you've ever written.

not that you’re obsessive about your hobbies. that’s drivel. but the other stuff. ;-)

Half Dome is my bitch. Shasta is next.

by Toonderstrook on Jun 12, 2008 6:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

about finding music? or the post?

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

the past v. now.

Half Dome is my bitch. Shasta is next.

by Toonderstrook on Jun 12, 2008 6:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Historical perspective is very valuable

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 6:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

so it looks like

we have a pretty bad farm system

thx for putting that together though, it had to be done.

I wonder if Danny Richar sucks this bad.

John Shelby probably won’t be much more than a 4th OFer if he makes it that far. I don’t think of him much as a prospect. To think that he’s still really our top position player prospect. Ugh.

by Daniel Berlyn on Jun 12, 2008 6:15 PM CDT reply actions  

Unless he really can't stick up the middle somewhere, Shelby looks good to me

I don’t know that there’s evidence he
can’t either.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 12, 2008 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't understand the Shelby love...

His walk-to-strikeout ratio makes him look like a less talented Corey Patterson.

by SSH2005 on Jun 12, 2008 9:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

his K rate hadn't been an issue up until this year and there are injury caveats there

but you’re right and I wrote that would be an issue. but i’d rather have someone who has shown he can hit and let them figure out the nuances of approach rather than vice versa. in fact, i don’t think you can do it the other way.

dude, that was totally not swish you saw on rush street last night. swish was at home playing xbox.

by colintj on Jun 13, 2008 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to South Side Sox! Please check our new standards and guide to FanPosts/FanShots before posting.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Jacksoncloseup_small
BMO 2021: When Buehrle closes in on 300/3000
Digital_booklet_-_in_rainbows_01_small
RRRR: Counting of the heads (Meet-up 2012)
Avatarsing_small
2012 White Sox PECOTA
Archerme_small
RRRR: Oscars, wild.
Mrsparkleorig_small
Calling all new readers and lurkers: Open thread on Feb. 6

Recent FanPosts

Rudylaw_small
Hitting Instruction
61y5zkwuutl__sl500__small
High and Tight on the Mendoza Line
Small
Oswalt?
Digital_booklet_-_in_rainbows_01_small
RRRR: Dental dams and other reasons to kill people
Digital_booklet_-_in_rainbows_01_small
RRRR: HSALTP! SL. SLTP!

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recent FanShots

White Sox Sign Fukudome
Cespedes to Athletics.
Brooks Boyer Defends 2012 Slogan
2012 Chicago White Sox Consensus Top 36 Prospects
Top 101 Baseball Prospects
Marlins Make Offer to Cespedes
Bill James: Open Letter To The Hall Of Fame
Keith Law says our minor league system sucks - hard.
Boom Goes the Dynamically Priced Tickets!
Does Mark Parent regret leaving the Reading Phillies? Because, man, if I'd known this was coming...

+ New FanShot All FanShots >


Managing Editor

Mrsparkleorig_small Jim Margalus

Editors

Deadhorse_small larry

Sealab_murphy_small colintj

Digital_booklet_-_in_rainbows_01_small homesickalien

Omar_small U-God

Authors

10083hb_small KenWo4LiFe

Archerme_small Teahenny Penny