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Danks Returns to Form, Sox Still Fall

There was a small silver lining to be found from Sunday's loss to the Angels. John Danks appeared to have worked through his dead arm period, lost release point, whatever he had going on, to put together a nice (though not "quality") start. Danks still found himself leaving his changeup high in the zone in his last two innings of work, but the change was down in innings 1-4. Plus, he seemed to have both better control and the ability to more readily put hitters away, as evidenced by his 7:1 K/BB ratio.

Danks was pulled in the 6th after he allowed his first run of the game following back-to-back-to-back hard hit balls over the span of just 5 pitches. His quick exit was determined more by base and out situation and the scoreboard than it was by pitch count, but with his change losing effectiveness late I'd say he was getting a bit tired. Still, Danks as an 80-90 pitch pitcher is better than the Danks we saw doing 5th starter impersonations in the last few outings. If I was Ozzie, I'd keep Danks at or around 90 pitches for the remainder of the regular season.

Offensively, the Sox managed just two solo-shots (one each by Paul Konerko and Toby Hall) against Joe Saunders. Ozzie went with a rare all-right-handed batting order, subbing in Brian Anderson and Josh Fields (combined 0-6) in addition to Hall. Individually, all of the subs could be defended, but I don't like seeing 3 subs in any one so-called Sunday lineup and I would have liked to have seen at least one left-hander breaking up the parade of righties.

The Angels scored the eventual winning run following a couple of questionable choices. First, Horacio Ramirez entered a tied game. As if that wasn't bad enough, Ozzie called up Ehren Wasserman with the go-ahead run 90 feet from home and nobody out. After Wasserman coaxed a first-pitch ground out from Vlad Guerrero, Ozzie called for the intentional IBB of Torii Hunter to load the bases, which seemed odd to me with Juan Rivera on deck, almost assuredly to be replaced by the left-handed Garrett Anderson. Sure enough, Anderson came on as a pinch-hitter, and lifted a deep fly ball down the right field line. Jermaine Dye caught the ball in foul territory, just a step or two from the wall, which allowed Guerrero to score easily from 3rd.

I questioned the IBB, but if you're going to play for the double play, if your intent is to increase the likelihood of allowing no runs in the inning at the expense of increasing the odds of a big inning, why catch a ball in foul territory that results in a sure run? Wasn't the all-or-nothing directive set by the walking of right-handed batter to load the bases for what eventually turned into left-handed batter? I don't fault Dye for catching the ball. It just seems to me that the two plays came from opposite ends of the run-prevention playbook. But baseball players probably don't think that way, and certainly not as they're running toward the line to make a catch just a few feet in front of a low wall.

Where Was That Pitch?

For once, Hawk's constant whining about balls and strikes was warranted. Just take a look at this chart. See those 7 or 8 little green squares in the lower right side of the zone? Those are called balls for White Sox pitching. Notice all those red triangles around that area? Those are essentially the same pitches thrown by Anaheim pitchers, but they were called strikes. One or two of those pitches going uncalled is unfortunate, 7 or more is a pattern. That pattern really seemed to get accentuated after Ozzie Guillen gave home plate ump Eric Cooper an earful from the dugout when he awarded timeout to an Angels batter for the second time after Danks had started his motion.

I'm not saying. I'm just saying...

Make no mistake about it, the Sox did not lose Sunday's game because of Cooper's divergent strike zones. But there's no question that those strikes-called-balls changed the outcome of at-bats, which in turn changed the shape of an inning, and thus influenced the outcome of the game.

Bigger Picture

For a weekend that started out about as poorly as imaginable, with the loss of the unicorn-riding, stuff-you-liking, homer-hittin' Carlos Quentin, and ended with the Sox blowing a 2-run lead, I'm feeling pretty good about the weekend in general. I quickly processed the loss of Quentin, with a little Al Davisism "Just win, baby."

The Sox and Twins are both flawed teams. The Sox are an offensively old, slow team and don't really know what they're going to get from any of their 5 starters on any given night. While the Twins offense is powered by 2 superstars surrounded by a merry band of role players, but their bullpen, which is usually a strength, has let them down. One of these two teams, flaws included, has to make the post-season. Might as well be the Sox.

If you had told me on Friday, in that woe-is-me happy hour after we found out Q! had passed on but before first pitch, that the Sox would have taken 2-out-of-3 from the first place, playoff-bound Angels, I would have been happy. If you would have told me that the Twins were gonna drop 2-out-of-3 to the Tigers in the Metrodome, blowing leads in both losses, I wouldn't have believed you. Picking up a game on the Twins, while simultaneously taking 3 home games off their remaining schedule is a big win for the Sox.

All-in-all, the weekend turned out about as well as you could have reasonably expected.

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"Deserve's got nothin to do with it."

by U-God on Sep 8, 2008 8:09 AM CDT   0 recs

The next few games are rough...

A.J. Burnett
Jesse Litsch
Roy Halladay
TBA
Justin Verlander

"god, you’re fucking stupid."
-- Larry

by SSH2005 on Sep 8, 2008 8:35 AM CDT   0 recs

I was having Budweiser and some

wings at that new place on 35th and Halsted after the game yesterday, when I noticed the guy sitting next to me had a huge Sox World Series ring. I introduced myself. He was Bryan Little, who played with the Sox in ‘85-86. He is now their Major League advance scout. He told me flatly the Blue Jays were the best team in baseball…and he didn’t stutter, reaffirming that statement a couple times. Whereas I don’t necessarily agree, I don’t think it an outlandish thought, by any means. Of course, he raved about their pitching. He saw them last week vs. the Twins.

by dantesox on Sep 8, 2008 9:03 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

That's a very scouty thing to say...

if you saw the Blue Jays only this week (and didn’t look at any numbers), you probably would think that they were the best team in baseball. They’re on an eight-game winning streak, and have been playing very good baseball since the All-Star Break.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Sep 8, 2008 9:12 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

We talked about some other things, too.

He was remarkably glib. Said the Sox were a bad defensive team. Although that’s no big surprise, I was a little taken aback at how forthright he was. Maybe he thought I had some credibility because I remembered him and buttered him up by calling him one of the greatest bunters the game had ever seen. No joke.

by dantesox on Sep 8, 2008 9:18 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

In addition....

I watched quite a bit of that series. Except for the middle infield, the Jays are probably as good in sum total everywhere else as anyone in baseball. And I love Travis Snider….great hitter real soon. They’re gonna be a co-favorite next year if they keep their pitching together….Burnett, for one is a free agent.

by dantesox on Sep 8, 2008 9:13 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The Jays are pretty meh.

They don’t really have any huge holes anywhere, but aside from Halladay, they don’t really have any stars, either. They’re good, but it’ll be difficult to make them great.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Sep 8, 2008 9:16 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

They have a pretty great bullpen...

This year at least. I don’t expect Jesse Carlson and Scott Downs to repeat their performances (who would?). Their Pythag pegs them at 81-61.

They don’t overwhelm me. I think they could be great — with a full season of healthy Vernon Wells and a few tweaks here and there.

by Craig Grebeck on Sep 8, 2008 9:18 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

it's not a hugely controversial statement to say the three best teams in the american league are in the al east.

i wouldn’t call the jays the best team because their offense is not that great. but their pitching staff is the best in baseball.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 9:19 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

With a total team hitting VORP of 81

I dont think I would be buying that one. Their pitching is absolutely fantastic no argument their.

Rays only 1.5 up on Boston.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 9:35 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

They've underachieved.

I’m looking at them as if people were having reasonably decent years. And someone has to emerge as a power presence….could be Snider. However…..the power could come from Rios. Lind, Wells….etc. all just doing a little more in that area.

by dantesox on Sep 8, 2008 9:42 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Well I agree no one would probably want to face them in the playoffs.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 9:45 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i'm not certain what insight slicing up their team vorp provides.

total it up and consider their competition. the white sox and angels may have somewhat higher team vorps. but they get to play a whole lot more shit.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 9:54 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Slice it whatever way you want

11th in runs in the AL. It is what is.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 9:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

right. so?

1st by far in the AL in runs against. what difference does it make how a team gets to a +88 run differential?

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 10:01 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What's your point?

Im not saying the Jays suck. I said their offense wasnt good and its not. Their hot right now but that won’t cloud my judgement for the whole season.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 10:04 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What don't you get Larry.

I don’t think they are better than the White Sox or the Angels. I pointed to their offense as part of my evaluation.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 10:11 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Girls, Girls!

You’re both pretty.

by ReservoirDog on Sep 8, 2008 10:28 AM CDT to parent up   1 recs

Umm exactly

Which is why I tend to subscribe a lot more to a team’s record this late in the year. Toronto is 10 games over and used a recent 8 game streak to get there. The Angels are 30 games over, have won on the road this year and trounced the East head to head.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 10:29 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

lol

I don’t really see how Im doing that. Why because its the only thing you should consider? All Im attempting to do is slow down this train of Angel diss. They are flawed. No doubt. But they HAVE done a few things this year others have struggled with like win on the road and beat the acknowledged toughest division in baseball.

Exactly eight days ago Toronto was 2 games over .500. This isnt a 3rd or half the season, its 3/4 past. I believe it was CWSKeith who referenced a piece at some point you have to start acknowledging a team’s record vs their pythag. A lesson the Sox have learned all too well over seasons.

Im not calling the Jays busters or pushovers. I just don’t think they are 1 of the top 3 teams in the AL.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 10:47 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

that piece you reference was discussing how they will perform over the last month or so of the season and why using Elo and stuff may be a better predictor.

not how they should/did perform over the course of the whole season. one still uses pythag to analyze the overall performance of a team to help determine whether/how they under or overachieved.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 11:01 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Fine Larry.

I’ll take the Angels and Sox ahead of Toronto. You can put who like in your Top 3.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 11:11 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

who you like

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 11:11 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm not a huge fan...

of pythag myself, but the fact is that it’s a better predictor of future success or failure than raw w/l.

Since larry likes BP, here’s the 3rd-order adjusted standings (which tries to look beyond raw runs scored/allowed and adjusts for strength of schedule) -

1. Red Sox – 90-53
2. Rays – 85-56
3. Blue Jays – 80-62
4. Yankees – 80-63
5. White Sox – 79-63
6. Indians – 74-67
7. Angels – 73-69
8. Twins – 73-70

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Sep 8, 2008 11:23 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I think we are all aware of their 3rd order record

And I can 100% disagree with you on it being a better predictor of future success than w/l record at this point of the season or most of the season for that matter.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 11:27 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

not sure where future success entered this conversation and why it did.

so we’re clear, my contention is the top three teams in the AL are in the AL east. that’s for the season.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 11:31 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I know Larry

Not directed at you. I understand what argument you are making.

The SSS motto should be the answer to "What is our deepest fear?". Or maybe just Prozac.

by Tdogg on Sep 8, 2008 11:32 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

that was for both of you.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 11:34 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I think it's close enough...

that it’s probably not really that big of a deal.

The Red Sox and Rays are pretty clearly 1-2, and a bunch of teams are fairly close together for third.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Sep 8, 2008 11:37 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The Angels might have something to say about that...

but I’m surprised at how arguable it is that the Jays are as good or better than the Angels.

The thing about this year is that, while there are several good teams, there are no real standout, excellent teams. The Cubs are probably the closest thing to that, but they’re flawed, too, and they’ve beefed up their numbers against some pretty crappy NL teams.

It’s making for an interesting season, that’s for sure.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Sep 8, 2008 9:39 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

well, the angels can talk all they want.

but i don’t think they’re as good as the jays. they get to play out west, after all, while the jays have the privilege of routinely getting to play two teams that are certainly better than them and another that’s probably about as good. i don’t think the angels are better than the sox and perhaps even the twins, personally. but they have stacked up the wins so they get to be in the argument.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 9:45 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Absolutely.

I thing the Angels are the most overrated team in baseball, and have been saying it for months now.

by dantesox on Sep 8, 2008 9:47 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What?

Where the hell are allof them, then? You must be living in a different world than I.

by dantesox on Sep 8, 2008 9:50 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

sorry. i forgot that some people actually listen to and consider the opinions of idiots.

i’ll revise. no one who actually knows anything about baseball thinks the angels’ record accurately reflects their talent.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 9:56 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

They play the game...

the “right way”.

In all seriousness, the difference between the Jays pitching and the Angels pitching is probably Roy Halladay (and that’s a big difference).

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Sep 8, 2008 9:51 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I'll tell you this, though.

They are a hell of a lot better with Texeira in the middle of that lineup. Before, not too scary.

by dantesox on Sep 8, 2008 9:56 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i like the jays bullpen better than the angels'

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 9:57 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

From top to bottom, sure.

the back of the Angels’ bullpen isn’t really that exciting.

But that’s not a huge flaw.

I’d take the Angels’ lineup (now that they have Teixeira) over the Jays’, although I’m not a fan of Juan Rivera or Garret Anderson.

But the Angels are a very flawed team, I agree.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Sep 8, 2008 10:05 AM CDT to parent up   0 recs

The Jays are a good team

Especially since they got out from under that moron of a manager they had at the beginning of the year.

I think I’d still take the Angels though. They have more experience in big games. Garrett Anderson is a pure hitter. Reminds me a lot of Harold Baines. Plus with Hunter, Lackey, KRod, Vlad, Arredondo, Big Tex, Saunders, Shields…. The Jays may get to that point next year or the year after…but not right now

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 4:49 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you must not remember harold fondly.

"maybe we could stop and pick up some tabasco?"

by Toonderstrook on Sep 8, 2008 5:04 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

he was a hell of a lot better hitter than garret anderson.

"maybe we could stop and pick up some tabasco?"

by Toonderstrook on Sep 8, 2008 5:06 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

I would always pick harold over any other lefty i have ever seen.

but if i had to compare someone to him (as far as average, style and personality) no one compares better to him than Anderson

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 5:09 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

i'm not sure i agree with you a hundred percent there on your police work, there, lou.

"i'd like to think of me returning when i can to the greatest little boozer and to sally maclennane."

by Toonderstrook on Sep 8, 2008 5:13 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

you guys act as if anderson is shit

His career average is .296. He has 2300+ hits, he has 271 homers and 1283 RBI’s. From 2000-2003 he hit at least 28 homers and knocked in at least 116 runs. This is why i compare him to Baines because unless you are a fan of the team he plays on you don’t really know too much other than his name.

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 5:15 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

not that he's shit. he just ain't no hal baines.

he has two full seasons with an ops+ better than baines’ lifetime ops+.

"i'd like to think of me returning when i can to the greatest little boozer and to sally maclennane."

by Toonderstrook on Sep 8, 2008 5:16 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

As far as being a great hitter, who is a quiet guy

both lefty, both under rated…. I think they compare pretty favorably. Of course I would pick Harold if i was starting a team….but Anderson is a good option “B” in my opinion.

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 5:25 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

garret anderson is not and has never been a great hitter.

"i'd like to think of me returning when i can to the greatest little boozer and to sally maclennane."

by Toonderstrook on Sep 8, 2008 5:34 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

his lifetime and yearly stats say otherwise.

That is the same statement that people make about Baines everytime the hall of fame voting comes up.

Find a player that compares better to baines in the last 20 years as far as stats, personality and style. maybe you will find a better one

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 5:37 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

there might not be a good comparison to harold baines, but that doesn't mean garret anderson is a good comp either.

"i'd like to think of me returning when i can to the greatest little boozer and to sally maclennane."

by Toonderstrook on Sep 8, 2008 5:39 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

There you go

I’ve been saying that for years..finally I am justified. Thank you El Guapo

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 5:56 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Just remember: All assertions made on this site are now being monitored for strict mathematical accuracy at all times.

Even the slightest deviations from the most rigid standards for truth and rectitude will no longer be tolerated.

Oh, and that goes for YOU too (points everywhere at once).

by The Actual El Guapo on Sep 8, 2008 6:05 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 5:57 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

Larry

I’m interested to hear your take….what do you think?

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 5:58 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

well

i hadn’t given it much thought prior to three minutes ago and initially i’ll say that harold was a better hitter because he got on base more. but if your contention that anderson is the most comparable player right now to baines, i think i have to defer to BR for that. seems like you’ve got it nailed.

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(Q!)geois

by larry on Sep 8, 2008 6:03 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs

What a proud moment

a KenWo victory on South Side Sox…. I am smiling from ear to ear right now! If my wife walked in she’d think i had just cheated on her with my cheesy smile haha

Kenwo4life=ratings

by KenWo4LiFe on Sep 8, 2008 6:08 PM CDT to parent up   0 recs