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How Much Would Adam Dunn Cost?

While larry has a sane take on the matter, some folks are starting to hop off the Adam Dunn wagon for fear of his excess cost and/or lack of production.  Those who are convinced of the latter should reconsider.  He's projected to be the 13th most productive hitter in all of baseball for the rest of the season.  He's been the 15th most productive over the last three seasons.  Were he to be traded to the Sox, he'd instantly be their best hitter.  For a team we've long complained lacks a DH, his production is perfect for that spot.  If acquired at the half season mark, he'd be worth what Jim Thome was projected for over a full season of play.  To that end, he'd completely overturn the biggest complaint reasonable fans have had since the off-season ended. 

So he fits from a production stand point.  But can he be had? 

Star-divide

We can find out using the same method Dave Cameron employs here in figuring Cliff Lee's return.  Bottom line, the return depends on his contract and projected performance.  The arithmetic looks like this:

Dunn is owed $12MM for 2010 and is projected to be worth about 3 wins. If he was being paid market rate ($3.5MM per win), he'd make $11MM or so.  That is, he's being paid what he's worth and he's about revenue neutral for a playoff contender.  Moreover, the Nationals, now free of the contract, would be able to buy the wins lost from trading Dunn at market price.  In that case, even if they get no one in return, the Nationals come out even in the trade: the difference between actually having Adam Dunn and being able to buy equivalent production is negligible.

But we must also factor in free agent compensation.  Dunn is right at the cusp between a Type A and Type B free agent at this point.  That's the difference between a first round pick and a supplemental rounder and just a supplemental.  So Dunn's surplus value, we can say, is about half a first round pick plus the supplemental pick.  Thanks to Victor Wang, we know that's equal to about one grade B prospect.  Guys given B grades are not top 100 prospects and are more like, say, Brent Morel

Should we worry about losing Morel?  If you're getting fair price for him, there's no cause for concern unless you think he's seriously undervalued.  And why think that?  In any case, prospects of Morel's caliber become league regulars less than 10% of the time.  In all likelihood, we'd never hear from him again.

So the Sox are set, right?  They can pay the approximate price the Nationals would ask, so everything's cool.  NSFMF:

The problem for the White Sox is that they aren't exactly a buyer's dream.  The selection of prospects is weak.  The level of prospect that should get Dunn is like a Morel plus like an A ball pitcher with upside.  Problem is that the Nationals don't need a 3B at all.  So you then have to offer Flowers or a hodge podge of lesser prospects.  The former is too much.  The latter is not something I'd take from the White Sox.

Unless Brent Morel is the Nats' preference among the various about equal value offers, they'll go with someone else.  Typically, the Sox see prospects rise from their system to provide for exactly the kind of acquisition we're discussing, but the 2010 version of Daniel Cortes, DLS, Dexter Carter, Brandon Allen, Aaron Cunningham etc. is nowhere to be found.  Worse for the Sox' flexibility, their actually good prospects outside of Brent Morel just so happen to be at positions of need.  Viciedo* and Flowers would seem to fit very well into the Sox' future plans given the expiration date on Paulie and AJ.  And I have to think Hudson more likely portends a trade of the current top 4 given the current accounting.  That leaves Morel and a few others who are too much or too little.  Then there are guys like Jared Mitchell or Trayce Thompson.  They're talented, but what assurances can you make about their injuries?

Ultimately, I think this line of thinking leads to the conclusion that Kenny is going to have to get creative.  The system is as bad as it's lately been in sum, but with worse depth than usual.  So either Hudson or Flowers is on the block, or we're talking about current White Sox contributors.  Or maybe we're lucky and the Nats actually are in love with Brent Morel. 

No matter how this plays out, it speaks to the hole that Kenny has dug for himself in the construction of the team.  The kinds of deals most teams make around this time basically amounts to the efficient distribution of players in contract years.  By this point in the season, it's obvious whether or not guys with deals expiring at season's end are worth it.  It takes far more calculation and interpersonal skills to pull off the kind of deal that makes the team better now and in the future while dealing with the kind of limited resources the Sox have their disposal.  Fortunately for us, Kenny Williams is exactly the kind of guy who knows how to avoid being hoisted by his own petard.  I think.**

*Viciedo also has a weird contract.  Thanks to the deal, the standard minimum pay for younger players and the accompanying usual surplus value doesn't apply.  He's got more upside than Morel, but will be paid what he's worth.  So he doesn't have much surplus value unless it's obvious he's a future regular.  And if he is, why would Kenny pass on that for a half year of Dunn?

**FNS aside.  Also: apparently "petard" comes from the Latin for flatulence.

Comment 153 comments  |  3 recs  | 

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everyone has their price and can be bought

and Reinsdorf and Co needs to do so. im not saying they need to break the bank, but they do need to take the risk of taking a loss on the season financially to try and make it to the post season. end of point.

great post colintj

Just taking a couple minutes to act like a retard.
Thank you, thank you, SSS. Thank you for accepting people who act like retards, if not actual retards. by Mitch. on Jun 24, 2010 1:16 PM CDT

by Grinder Rule #42 on Jul 1, 2010 10:17 AM CDT reply actions  

Man are you cynical.

However, Dunn is in Washington, and in this instance I happen to agree with you.

You got to gird your loins. Life continues. There are good days. There are bad days, but you keep hustling to survive. - Chet Lemon

by winningugly on Jul 1, 2010 3:54 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

Reinsdorf wont pull the trigger on this

Hes throwing every dime he has at Lebron James, not Adam Dunn

''I'm not in the gym every morning now for the Cy Young. I want what the boys did in 2005. I want that dog pile, that memory, that ring.''

by TheIronSchenk on Jul 1, 2010 6:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

you mean every dime that he just got from expiring contracts?

something tells me even the mafia wouldn't call on greg walker if a hit was needed.

-MarketMaker

by blackoutsox on Jul 1, 2010 7:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

?

There’s a salary cap in basketball. It’s not like he can throw 100 million at LBJ

by Grinder in Training on Jul 1, 2010 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

why the fuck would he throw 100 million at lebron?

youd think he would want to pay him instead.

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 1, 2010 7:19 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

I guess the gist i was going for here is

Jerry Reinsdorf is a little preoccupied at this time..i dont think selling off young prospects for 2 months of Adam Dunn to MAYBE put this team into a position to make the playoffs and get shilacked in the first round is really going to happen here.

''I'm not in the gym every morning now for the Cy Young. I want what the boys did in 2005. I want that dog pile, that memory, that ring.''

by TheIronSchenk on Jul 1, 2010 8:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

This

"Let’s plunge ourselves into the roar of time, the whirl of accident; may pain and pleasure, success and failure, shift as they will- it’s only action that can make a man" Faust, Goethe

by Ahillock on Jul 2, 2010 10:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

Thanks for the sanity check

great post

This is not early panic, it’s continued disgust with a situation we didn’t like to begin with. - Grinder in Training

by Jack M on Jul 1, 2010 10:25 AM CDT reply actions  

if the nationals were for some reason enamored with flowers

it’s possible they’d be willing to send cash to buy a better prospect from the white sox.

or perhaps there’s another player(s) on the nationals the white sox would want and then could put together a package of some time.

by larry on Jul 1, 2010 10:26 AM CDT reply actions  

Willingham would be nice.

Although he’s RH, his splits are pretty even, solid OBP, less of a defensive liability than Dunn, but won’t hit as many HR’s.

by ExileDC on Jul 1, 2010 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

Any chance we could nab Jordan Zimmermann while he is on the mend?

"Yes, I am impatient. Yes, I am frustrated. But yes, I still do remain confident that this team is the team that can still challenge for the division championship and hopefully beyond. We've got a lot of good pieces, we just need to all come together and we'll be just fine."

- Kenny Williams

by justjc on Jul 1, 2010 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

top notch

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 10:29 AM CDT reply actions  

Sounds like someone else we know.
Were he to be traded to the Sox, he’d instantly be their best hitter.

I believe we thought the same about Alex Rios Last year as well. But as soon as he joined the Sox he had a terrible rest of the year. Hopefully the same will not be said about Dunn if we decide to go after him.

aaand boom goes the dynamite...

by brichter45 on Jul 1, 2010 10:34 AM CDT reply actions  

Oh i agree he was hitting great.

That’s my point though, hopefully the same doesn’t happen to Dunn if we get him..

aaand boom goes the dynamite...

by brichter45 on Jul 1, 2010 10:38 AM CDT up reply actions  

Touche

You’re right, he had 14 HRs and a .264 BA before coming to the Sox. Would of expected him to at least keep up the production.

aaand boom goes the dynamite...

by brichter45 on Jul 1, 2010 10:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

5 of those HR's came in May, when he hit over .300

The rest of his year wasn’t that great. He was free for a reason.

None the less, he obviously did do worse with his new team, but Dunn has moved between teams mid-season before, so it would probably be easier on him than Rios.

by Grinder in Training on Jul 1, 2010 10:45 AM CDT up reply actions  

as a fantasy owner of Rios in 09

I can tell you he was beyond worthless at the plate.

Lurking since 2006

by boyonthedock on Jul 1, 2010 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Not sure how much this matters or how much it's "true"

but Dunn is reportedly happy playing in the NL in general and for the Nats in particular.

Could potentially affect how well he might play in the AL and for the Sox.

Best game I ever attended was the 163rd game of 2008.

by NorthSidePaulie on Jul 1, 2010 1:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think that's mainly him not wanting to be a DH

But with the Sox, he’d probably get a fair amount of time in the field, knowing Ozzie.

by Grinder in Training on Jul 1, 2010 2:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

stats for reference

SEASON G AB R H RBI BB SO SB CS AVG OBP SLG OPS
2009 41 146 11 29 9 6 29 5 2 .199 .229 .301 .530

aaand boom goes the dynamite...

by brichter45 on Jul 1, 2010 10:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

what about that makes you think he was hitting "great"?

This is not early panic, it’s continued disgust with a situation we didn’t like to begin with. - Grinder in Training

by Jack M on Jul 1, 2010 10:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

ah i thought that's what you were using to back up your hitting great claim

reply chain confusion

This is not early panic, it’s continued disgust with a situation we didn’t like to begin with. - Grinder in Training

by Jack M on Jul 1, 2010 11:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

give them jeff marquez

they’re bound to take it!

that would involve a whole bunch of skull fucking.-BoeJouma

by furby2056 on Jul 1, 2010 10:39 AM CDT reply actions  

Why do you always have to give someone up?

I never understand this? Why not say here’s $x million dollars, that’s how it works in football

by hoodlight on Jul 1, 2010 10:45 AM CDT reply actions  

Its 1812 all over again!

"Fuck fangraphs and your fancy designer stats can go pound some hard sand"- Billyok

by DrEmilioLizardo on Jul 1, 2010 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

this is funny and ironic

for me to day as I explained free agency to one of my foreign co workers. “Why can’t they just buy Lebron,” he asked.

Cuz its not soccer dude.

"Officially off strike...."

by Tdogg on Jul 1, 2010 7:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

so you're saying

there’s not even one lousy Lance Broadway-type bone left to throw them?

See Astros, Houston.

"But this streak goes to eleven"

by ChicagoPete on Jul 1, 2010 10:51 AM CDT reply actions  

Dunn for Q straight up?

"Let’s plunge ourselves into the roar of time, the whirl of accident; may pain and pleasure, success and failure, shift as they will- it’s only action that can make a man" Faust, Goethe

by Ahillock on Jul 1, 2010 10:52 AM CDT reply actions  

what's the point?

Then they stick Kotsay or Teabag in RF. The whole point of getting Dunn is to get those clowns out of the lineup.

"But this streak goes to eleven"

by ChicagoPete on Jul 1, 2010 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

Trade Teabag and Kotsay for DeJesus

"Let’s plunge ourselves into the roar of time, the whirl of accident; may pain and pleasure, success and failure, shift as they will- it’s only action that can make a man" Faust, Goethe

by Ahillock on Jul 1, 2010 10:57 AM CDT up reply actions  

Plus maybe a B prospect?

"Let’s plunge ourselves into the roar of time, the whirl of accident; may pain and pleasure, success and failure, shift as they will- it’s only action that can make a man" Faust, Goethe

by Ahillock on Jul 1, 2010 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'd be OK with trading buehrle for dunn

the trade makes sense for both teams and both players..

Staying Out of White Sox Business

by benlinus on Jul 1, 2010 11:00 AM CDT reply actions  

Or do a 3 way with the Cardinals and Nationals.

Send Buehrle to STL. Sox get Dunn. Nationals get some prospects from STL.

"Let’s plunge ourselves into the roar of time, the whirl of accident; may pain and pleasure, success and failure, shift as they will- it’s only action that can make a man" Faust, Goethe

by Ahillock on Jul 1, 2010 11:02 AM CDT up reply actions  

Does STL have good prospects?

I would have no idea.

Thanks alot for these ridiculous ticket prices, 2005.

by ScottyPods Ver2.0 on Jul 1, 2010 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

It got diluted after the Holliday and DeRosa trades

but they still have some good prospects in Jaime Garcia, Allen Craig, Bryan Anderson.

"Let’s plunge ourselves into the roar of time, the whirl of accident; may pain and pleasure, success and failure, shift as they will- it’s only action that can make a man" Faust, Goethe

by Ahillock on Jul 1, 2010 12:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Jordan Danks?

something tells me even the mafia wouldn't call on greg walker if a hit was needed.

-MarketMaker

by blackoutsox on Jul 1, 2010 11:36 AM CDT reply actions  

Thank you Colin for that sane take on a good potential move

Does anyone know where Cowley gets his information from?

"Yes, I am impatient. Yes, I am frustrated. But yes, I still do remain confident that this team is the team that can still challenge for the division championship and hopefully beyond. We've got a lot of good pieces, we just need to all come together and we'll be just fine."

- Kenny Williams

by justjc on Jul 1, 2010 12:06 PM CDT reply actions  

Fuck Nick Swisher

I like typing it out. all these acronyms of swear words make me feel like I’m on BCB sometimes. and I hate that feeling.

Lurking since 2006

by boyonthedock on Jul 1, 2010 12:23 PM CDT reply actions  

but you used an acronym swear again!

the site is called “bleed, cubbie bitches”, right?

These events have me frightened and on the verge of evacuating my bowels.

by thatshortkid on Jul 1, 2010 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

i think the name

is sad enough that it needs no MAD-magazine style embellishments.

Lurking since 2006

by boyonthedock on Jul 1, 2010 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

So a lack of profanity is bad

But childish insults also bad. This will be tough to keep up with all these rules.

by Grinder in Training on Jul 1, 2010 1:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

I demand that you all

bow down to my preferences. I’m frankly insulted i even had to let you all know.

Lurking since 2006

by boyonthedock on Jul 1, 2010 1:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Interesting footnote
**FNS aside. Also: apparently “petard” comes from the Latin for flatulence

He was one of Queen Victorias favourite acts.

by hoodlight on Jul 1, 2010 1:19 PM CDT reply actions  

hilarious:

“The climax of his act however involved him farting his impression of the 1906 San Francisco earthquake.”

Fireworks: Bang?

by colintj on Jul 1, 2010 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't know...

So Dunn is worth 3 wins? So if you consider the Sox a 80-85 win team right now, which I do, then Dunn makes them an 83-88 win team. Would that be enough to take the division? Also I take issue with Dunn(if traded for) becoming the best hitter. Dunn was crap in 2008 when he was traded from Cincy to Arizona. No given that he would continue to produce for the Sox.

I say try to trade Buehrle and cash to the Dodgers and see if you can get Matt Kemp.

Mark Teahen peed in my canteen.

by SavePeavytill2010 on Jul 1, 2010 1:22 PM CDT reply actions  

a .900 OPS is crap?

and dunn is worth 3 wins over a full season, not a half season.

by larry on Jul 1, 2010 1:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

but dunn would also be replacing a current dh who is below replacement level

so that actually makes him worth more because you eliminate that giant sucking sound from our dh spot which is subtracting wins

Staying Out of White Sox Business

by benlinus on Jul 1, 2010 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

maybe.

i think it’s generally best to just assume for these purposes that, if not for a trade, the white sox would be able to find someone(s) to provide replacement level production from that spot. but throw on a half win or something if you like.

by larry on Jul 1, 2010 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah for sure. Games 181,182 and 183

"Let’s plunge ourselves into the roar of time, the whirl of accident; may pain and pleasure, success and failure, shift as they will- it’s only action that can make a man" Faust, Goethe

by Ahillock on Jul 2, 2010 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions  

Buehrle has no surplus value

so you’d be buying Matt Kemp off the Dodgers. Good luck with that.

Fireworks: Bang?

by colintj on Jul 1, 2010 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Thx, colin.

"If you want to know what God thinks of money, just look at the people he gave it to."
— Dorothy Parker

by Chiburb on Jul 1, 2010 1:41 PM CDT reply actions  

Great post

Captures my trepidation about a “Dunn deal”. My worry isn’t that Dunn wouldn’t be a good fit for a crying need (I tend to think he is), but the realpolitik cost of getting him given what we have to offer and what the Nats might want.

Best game I ever attended was the 163rd game of 2008.

by NorthSidePaulie on Jul 1, 2010 1:48 PM CDT reply actions  

Another fine piece of writing, colin. Took the words right out of my mouth.

But really, as much I would love to see Dunn (or dream of Fielder, or whatever), I say no. I just don’t see the Sox making the playoffs this year, Dunn or not, and I’d hate for them to somehow weaken the farm even further.

"I'm tired, I've got a headache, my bullpen blew it." -South Side Expat

by Teahenny Penny on Jul 1, 2010 2:21 PM CDT reply actions  

I agree with this

I was very ambivalent during the winning streak. On one hand, I though, “Yay, they winning.” On the other hand, I thought, “Oh no, I hope KW doesn’t think we back in the race and trade Hudson for Carl Everett and Roberto Alomar.”

by joewho112 on Jul 1, 2010 3:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

the difference here

is that dunn is better than alomar and everett where when we got them

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 3:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

I didn't mean this to be about Dunn specifically.

I just meant trading prospects for veterans that provide marginal improvement this year.

I would prefer we ship out anyone with surplus value for prospects.

by joewho112 on Jul 1, 2010 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

True, of course.

But do you see Dunn propelling them into the playoffs, U-God? Oh, and if they actually are going to go for Dunn, can they do it now? Every game counts, Kenny.

"I'm tired, I've got a headache, my bullpen blew it." -South Side Expat

by Teahenny Penny on Jul 1, 2010 3:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

i could see it

but i tend to run optimistic

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nice work Colin.

June review should be done in a couple of hours.

"Officially off strike...."

by Tdogg on Jul 1, 2010 2:27 PM CDT reply actions  

Oh, fuck yes.

Looking forward to it.

"I'm tired, I've got a headache, my bullpen blew it." -South Side Expat

by Teahenny Penny on Jul 1, 2010 2:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

Nice timing, with a July 1 day off and all.

Should get plenty of top-of-the-order views.

"Strangely, Christ is a closeted homosexual…" - winningugly

by RWShow on Jul 1, 2010 4:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

June review up

"Officially off strike...."

by Tdogg on Jul 1, 2010 7:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

hope you don't mind

i cleaned it up a bit and ran the auto-tagger

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 7:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

no by all means

always and thanks!

"Officially off strike...."

by Tdogg on Jul 1, 2010 7:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

anytime

good shit. i almost didn’t want to change Killibridge into Lillibridge. if he could hit for any power, that would make for such a badass nickname.

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

hes done better this year

but it was in reference to all the ks last year.

"Officially off strike...."

by Tdogg on Jul 1, 2010 7:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

my bad then

assumed a slip of the finger. seems the saying about assumptions is true.

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 7:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

so where the shit is this post you two speak of?

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 1, 2010 7:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

where it always starts

RR

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 7:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

but its not thereuhhhhh!!!!

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 1, 2010 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes it is.

Reading is easy if you know how.

You got to gird your loins. Life continues. There are good days. There are bad days, but you keep hustling to survive. - Chet Lemon

by winningugly on Jul 1, 2010 8:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

weird, because its not showing up every single time i refresh

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 1, 2010 8:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

the internets take longer to get to iowa

its like popular music and fashion

Free Brent Lllibridge!

by e-gus on Jul 1, 2010 9:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Excellent post, Colin.

Thanks for setting it out in clear terms.

by palehose67 on Jul 1, 2010 2:28 PM CDT reply actions  

Are they only looking for a bat and not a pitcher?

I still think Torres is going to be a decent pitcher. He is having another solid year in AAA. His WHIP is better than Hudson’s. Maybe we dangle Floyd for Fielder. Milwaukee needs pitching.

by striker on Jul 1, 2010 3:32 PM CDT reply actions  

Well, obviously the Prince Fielder part…

"Strangely, Christ is a closeted homosexual…" - winningugly

by RWShow on Jul 1, 2010 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Which part?

Torres or Floyd? Our weakness right now is hitting and our strength is pitching. I think Floyd is awesome but we need a solid middle of the lineup bat. Right now we have 5 good pitchers but only need 3 or 4 if we make the playoffs. Fielder could contribute everyday where as Floyd contributes every 5th day. In fact, if it wasn’t for our putrid offense, Floyd would have won 3 games in a row. I also think Hudson wouldn’t be as dominate as Floyd can be but would be more consistent.

Think Milwaukee would bite? They get a solid starter and save money.

by striker on Jul 1, 2010 4:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think you’re underrating Floyd big time. It wouldn’t be a stretch to say he is the Sox’ best starting pitcher. He leads Sox starters in WAR this year and, IIRC, was the pitching staff’s leader last year. Beyond that, he’s extremely valuable as an asset. The Sox have him locked up through 2013, and he’s only going to make 5/7/9.5 over those three years. Even if you took a conservative (IMO) estimate and projected Floyd to 9 WAR over those three seasons, he’s still providing a decent amount of surplus value.

On the other hand, Fielder has one arbitration year left before free agency. He’s going to ask for — and likely receive — something in the vicinity of Ryan Howard’s five year, $125 extension. If I’m calculating this correctly, that means Fielder has to be a legit 6+ WAR player to be worth that money. I think I’d rather take my chances with Floyd + free agent 1B-man over Fielder.

by CWSKeith on Jul 1, 2010 5:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with the fellatio of Gavin

He’s done everything we could possibly want since ‘07. He added a tick to his fastball and his command has remained even as he’s (iirc) decreased fastball usage. His contact rate is like 4th lowest in the league. That plus an average walk rate is nearing ace levels. Way back when both were making their debuts for the squad, I said I liked Gavin if he could add a tick and a slider over Danks. That was pre-cutter, but I think I might honestly take Floyd as the better pitcher from here on out. His K rates promise to be better than Danks with similar command. Unless the GB rates are so respectively extreme as to cancel out the K/BB advantage, Gavin is the pick.

Fireworks: Bang?

by colintj on Jul 1, 2010 9:29 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

I wasn’t necessarily saying I would make that trade but I think it would take a Floyd or Danks to get a Fielder caliber player. I don’t think Hudson or Torres would get that deal done.

by striker on Jul 1, 2010 10:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Carlos Torres wouldn't get that done?

nonesense!! mumble mumble….

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Jul 1, 2010 10:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

or nonsense!!

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Jul 1, 2010 10:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree but business is business.

Buehrle is my favorite sox player. I also would rather see the sox in the playoffs, without Buehrle, then no playoffs at all. I think Buehrle has value, and could bring back someone who can give us 1.5 – 2 war this year. I would shop like silly. STL, SF, LAD, MIL, should all be interested, and willing to give us that 1.5 to 2 WAR for 2010.

"There's too many (bleeping) guys on the computer. It's simple. I say that. Pete Rose never watched a computer. Rod Carew never did. All those hitters, they go out and see the ball, hit it and move on." - Ozzie

by usualsuspect on Jul 1, 2010 10:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

trades

Yes, definiely go for a bat….even if it isn’t Dunn. And don’t give up pitching unless you can get pitching in return.

by walterfan34 on Jul 1, 2010 4:28 PM CDT reply actions  

how soon people forget about adrien.

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 1, 2010 6:53 PM CDT reply actions  

/slaps forehead

what a dumb typo

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 1, 2010 6:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

i like your fantasy name typo better

either said than done
when im pretty sure its supposed to be Ethier.

also, you should trade for Dunn.

Free Brent Lllibridge!

by e-gus on Jul 1, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

ouch. good call though

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 2, 2010 1:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

I haven't forgot about him

He is playing for a contending team now…

by 815Sox on Jul 1, 2010 7:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

We totes talked about Mr. Brody yesterday.

"I'm tired, I've got a headache, my bullpen blew it." -South Side Expat

by Teahenny Penny on Jul 1, 2010 7:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

ADRIEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"We can't do it easy. But we may as well do it high." -The Cheat

by South Side Expat on Jul 1, 2010 8:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

he yo adrian

i was thinking you and me we should get married you know

Free Brent Lllibridge!

by e-gus on Jul 1, 2010 9:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

ok, quick question....

there is an article about the sox on MLBTR and part of it is saying that Becks, Floyd and Danks are “all but untouchable”. Someone asked it on there and I was wondering too, does that mean they r untouchable or they are not untouchable?

by nsam93 on Jul 1, 2010 7:53 PM CDT reply actions  

it means it would take one hell of an offer to get them

i.e. a player of pujolsian calibur

When I was a kid, I didn't want to be a doctor or a fireman. I wanted to be Super Mario. It's the most literal pipe dream I've ever had.

by U-God on Jul 1, 2010 7:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

I doubt Danks is untouchable

Beckham probably is because his value is down and Floyd probably is because of his contract. I bet if the deal is right, Danks might be the Sox best bargaining chip….that they are actually willing to give up.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Jul 1, 2010 8:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Who is cheap for a long time and under control?

By that metric I’d bet Che is one of the most valuable chips. Floyd and Becks would qualify, too.

You got to gird your loins. Life continues. There are good days. There are bad days, but you keep hustling to survive. - Chet Lemon

by winningugly on Jul 1, 2010 8:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not my point

I agree that che, floyd and beckham are valuable chips. What I am trying to saying and maybe my explanation isn’t clear, is that Danks isn’t untouchable. Floyd I think would have to be, due to his contract to value and Beckham hopefully being untouchable since it wouldn’t be smart to move him when his value has dropped (I see potential, like most).

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Jul 1, 2010 10:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

lol
What I am trying to saying and maybe my explanation isn’t clear,

Free Brent Lllibridge!

by e-gus on Jul 2, 2010 4:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Que?

Heh.

You got to gird your loins. Life continues. There are good days. There are bad days, but you keep hustling to survive. - Chet Lemon

by winningugly on Jul 2, 2010 4:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

trade all 3 for braun gallardo and fielder

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 1, 2010 8:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Youdaman.

You got to gird your loins. Life continues. There are good days. There are bad days, but you keep hustling to survive. - Chet Lemon

by winningugly on Jul 1, 2010 8:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

Truer words were never spoken.

“…….Williams told Merkin that the team might also stand pat. Such a decision wouldn’t sit well with the Chicago media and fanbase, but it’s prudent of Williams to wait and see if his team really is as good as they’ve seemed of late before dealing a key prospect.”

"....we have to find a way to win. And good teams do that."

Tomas Kopecky May 29, 2010

by ballyb on Jul 2, 2010 4:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Crawford singles to give Rays lead over Twinks.

I love CC.

You got to gird your loins. Life continues. There are good days. There are bad days, but you keep hustling to survive. - Chet Lemon

by winningugly on Jul 1, 2010 9:19 PM CDT reply actions  

you got a thing for speedy, top of the order type, african american outfielders....

its your mancrush category.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Jul 1, 2010 10:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

longo ties it with a double to tie it.

go rays

"There's too many (bleeping) guys on the computer. It's simple. I say that. Pete Rose never watched a computer. Rod Carew never did. All those hitters, they go out and see the ball, hit it and move on." - Ozzie

by usualsuspect on Jul 1, 2010 10:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

i hate to admit it, but i like the straight-up camera angle at target field

These events have me frightened and on the verge of evacuating my bowels.

by thatshortkid on Jul 1, 2010 10:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

TB winnah!

These events have me frightened and on the verge of evacuating my bowels.

by thatshortkid on Jul 1, 2010 11:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

but who has the lead???

Watching this team is like jerking off 10 minutes after you just jerked off - billyok

by BoeJouma on Jul 2, 2010 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions  

another one bites the dust, Pinella moves up towards the front of the line....
Report: Hinch out in ArizonaEmail Print Comments ESPN.com news services

Arizona Diamondbacks manager A.J. Hinch has been fired, USA Today reported Thursday.

The Diamondbacks will make an official announcement Friday, two sources within the organization told the newspaper.

The Diamondbacks have the third-worst record in baseball at 31-48.

Hinch was hired on May 7, 2009, without any managerial experience, has a contract through 2012.

"Jenks, who was never afraid to say "no" to a hamburger..."

by BobbySouthSide on Jul 1, 2010 10:03 PM CDT reply actions  

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