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Around SBN: The Most Dangerous Division in Sports

Reading Room: Cell deal re-examined, but...

U.S. Cellular Field.

For fans who don't remember  or weren't around for the White Sox's near-move to Tampa Bay in 1988, the Illinois Sports Facility Authority is providing a bit of a history lesson as it tries to see what it can do about the rather lopsided deal then-Gov. Jim Thompson agreed to way back when.

As tailgater linked to in the FanShots, the current ISFA head is a bit peeved that the White Sox are paying the lowest rent in baseball. This has been the case for years, obviously, but two new structures are drawing more attention. Basically, the state doesn't like that Jerry Reinsdorf can build Bacardi at the Park and an upcoming sports merchandise store and reap all the profits.

The Chicago Tribune took a closer look at the Bacardi at the Park arrangement, and yes, the Sox got a sweet deal on that one, too. Especially considering:

Construction for the restaurant was initially covered by the Sox, who were reimbursed by the agency. In a records request response to the Tribune, the agency said all bids related to restaurant construction and operation were handled by the White Sox.

The restaurant at the Cell appears to be unusual for a major league baseball stadium. Some full-service restaurants accessible without a ticket to the game have opened in recent years without having to tap into public coffers.

At Yankee Stadium, two restaurants are accessible without entry to the ballpark, NYY Steak and Hard Rock Cafe. Both operate year round and were paid for without public assistance (unlike construction of the rest of the stadium, which the Yankees pay for mostly with tax-exempt bonds).

On Chicago's North Side, the Captain Morgan Club, owned and operated by the Cubs, was built next to Wrigley Field by the team without any public assistance. The restaurant can be accessed from the street and from inside the ballpark.

I'm no real estate or contract law expert, but my first impression is that this is why Reinsdorf is a wealthy, wealthy man.

Star-divide

Christian Marrero Reading Room

Here's a review of Knights Stadium in Charlotte Fort Mill, S.C., and I pretty much agree with everything that's said here. There's zero effort made for ambience, which doesn't matter if you're there to watch the games. But there's nothing really there to lure casual fans or families.

With Ozzie Guillen out of town, it looks like Joe Cowley has found another White Sox fan favorite to cozy up to, giving Frank Thomas another platform to express his sincere desire to be the new hitting coach.

Scott Merkin thinks the Sox are mostly stuck with what they have, although he phrases it in a friendlier fashion.

Lots of GIFfy goodness here. Octavio Dotel did not want to intentionally walk Nelson Cruz in Game 5. He followed orders, but grudgingly. Jeff Sullivan went back and found that Dotel just doesn't much care for the practice in general. Of course, this had me searching for Dotel's last IBB with the White Sox back in 2009, but the game isn't available on MLB.tv.

J.J. is already looking ahead to the 2013 White Sox, and wondering if Paul Konerko will be the only World Champion left.

Poz has a couple of really, really killer lines in this post. I don't want to spoil any of it.

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Thompson should be sharing a cell with Ryan.

WU got his ass handed to him by the Shit Rooster, of all people! Priceless.
Chiburb is an assclown. A real life loser and internet bore.

Mick11's SBN profile.

by Chiburb on Oct 27, 2011 6:53 AM CDT via mobile reply actions   1 recs

Blago disagrees.

"I considered throwing a volley, but since I'm considerably closer to Ford City than Dodge City, I figure it might have been misinterpreted."

by RWShow on Oct 27, 2011 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

He's not giving up his cell for fucking nothing.

The policeman who jumps from a bridge to a plane is Detective John McClane, a.k.a. Bruce Willis. He’s just the star of the whole movie series and stuff, no big deal or anything. -Cruiser

by Uribe Down on Oct 27, 2011 3:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Jerry Reinsdorf is a "job creator"...

…and if you don’t give him tax payer money to build businesses that he collects the profits on then the communists win! Jerry Reinsdorf took that money from the taxpayers fair and square and the people complaining are just jealous of his success.

by Cliff Poncier on Oct 27, 2011 8:00 AM CDT reply actions  

might as well make frank the hitting coach,

they hired robin ventura to be manager for fuck’s sake.

"michael gilhaney is an example of a man that is nearly banjaxed from the principal of the atomic theory. would it astonish you to hear that he is nearly half a bicycle?" ~~ sergeant pluck

by BuehrleMan on Oct 27, 2011 8:17 AM CDT reply actions  

That Tribune story was kind of a whoa moment for me

But it all comes off as a negotiation where the State via Thompson completely rolled over for JR.

by Titan52 on Oct 27, 2011 8:33 AM CDT reply actions  

Park Deal

Sounds like the whitesox lead by JR made a great move and they are reaping the benefits. Sour grapes isnt a defense for wanting more money. JR is a very smart business man and he leveraged the city with a move to Tampa to build the stadium and then he used the lease to his advantage by building up the park and adding revenue making facilities to it.

I also dont buy the city saying they dont receive anything after the intial 1.5 million in rent, they tax the tickets sales and the parking lot, doesnt that money count?

by Knoxfire30 on Oct 27, 2011 8:33 AM CDT reply actions  

He didn't leverage the city with a move to Tampa, he leveraged the fans.

WU got his ass handed to him by the Shit Rooster, of all people! Priceless.
Chiburb is an assclown. A real life loser and internet bore.

Mick11's SBN profile.

by Chiburb on Oct 27, 2011 8:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

But Reinsdorf’s sentimentality extends only so far. Business is still business. So in 1983, claiming the old Comiskey Park was “disintegrating,” and “if we didn’t get a new ballpark we’d go broke,” Reinsdorf again played hardball. Threatening to move the Sox to St. Petersburg, Florida, if Illinois legislators didn’t fund a new stadium, he now explained, “a savvy negotiator creates leverage. People had to think we were going to leave Chicago.” Those machinations angered St. Petersburg city administrator Rick Dodge. Realizing Reinsdorf was simultaneously negotiating with him and Illinois officials, he told his attorneys, “He was playing us off against each other. I’m not going to sit here and get chewed up like this.”

Chicagoans were equally annoyed with Reinsdorf’s Florida flirtation. Eddie Einhorn remembers going to a Cubs game with Reinsdorf and a fan yelling, “I wouldn’t get into that car after the game.” Reinsdorf received so many death threats, with anti-Semitic slurs, that he was forced to hire bodyguards and 24-hour security agents to protect his Chicago home.

Known as a negotiator who “lets things linger until he gets what he wants,” Reinsdorf did have one friend during the three-year imbroglio, Illinois Governor Jim Thompson. By June 1988, when it seemed certain that St. Pete would lure the Sox to its new Suncoast Dome, Big Jim twisted arms on the floor of the Illinois Senate, and the deal was done. Illinois funded a new stadium. As John Helyar writes, “Reinsdorf got the gold mine, and [St. Petersburg] got the shaft.”

Illinois taxpayers also got the short end of the deal. While Reinsdorf innocently insists, “I didn’t get into baseball to make money. Baseball is my religion. I’m happy to break even,” the Comiskey deal gave him free rent for up to 1.2 million in attendance each year. The Sox pay the state $2.50 for every ticket from 1.2 to 2 million, yet the team also gets back $5 million a year for stadium repairs and maintenance. In addition, the state buys 300,000 tickets if attendance drops below 1.5 after the year 2001, so in actuality, Reinsdorf got public funds to build his stadium and subsidies to guarantee its profitability.

http://www.cigaraficionado.com/webfeatures/show/id/Jerry-Reinsdorf-The-Most-Powerful-Man-in-Sports_7695

WU got his ass handed to him by the Shit Rooster, of all people! Priceless.
Chiburb is an assclown. A real life loser and internet bore.

Mick11's SBN profile.

by Chiburb on Oct 27, 2011 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

He's a brilliant business mind.

And still the best owner of any team in Chicago.

To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch

by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Oct 27, 2011 9:28 AM CDT up reply actions  

What does that have to do with the topic of taxpayers getting a raw deal with help from a slimy politico?

WU got his ass handed to him by the Shit Rooster, of all people! Priceless.
Chiburb is an assclown. A real life loser and internet bore.

Mick11's SBN profile.

by Chiburb on Oct 27, 2011 10:15 AM CDT up reply actions  

Starting to see how

A team can have the 5th or 6th highest payroll in baseball while ranking around 20th in attendance.

by MelidoPerez on Oct 27, 2011 12:52 PM CDT up reply actions  

Reading stuff like that

I can’t see how public revenue produced by the stadium (and the new bits) would ever actually equal what the State and City put up to build the thing.

Lousy deals seem to be a central part of public financing of stadiums. JR is a leader in that field and has the sweetest deal of all.

Funny how a master politician like Thompson can make deals in the lege (and stop time) to make the stadium happen, but not apply the same skill in negotiating the deals with the Sox.

by Titan52 on Oct 27, 2011 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

I wonder what the arrangement is between the city and the United Center.

Wikipedia hasn’t been very helpful.

To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch

by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Oct 27, 2011 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

Foreign investors. See the link above.

WU got his ass handed to him by the Shit Rooster, of all people! Priceless.
Chiburb is an assclown. A real life loser and internet bore.

Mick11's SBN profile.

by Chiburb on Oct 27, 2011 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

That was a very interesting piece, thanks.

To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch

by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Oct 27, 2011 10:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

From a source linked through the Field of Schemes website TasteeFreeze linked

On page 34 of this document it looks like the stadium itself was built by private money, with the City kicking in some infrastructure work and maybe some tax benefits. Presumably standard issue tax incentives to developers, but since we’re talking about JR and Wirtzes (who have manipulated state liquor laws to their sole advantage), it could easily be beyond that.

by Titan52 on Oct 27, 2011 10:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

That would be nice

Being a philanthropist is a good thing. Really Bruce Wayne would be the ideal sports owner. He’s got cubic fucktons of money, has vast philanthropic activities, and he personally donates his time to fighting crime. That’s a fictional guy making a serious difference in his fictional community.

But mostly I just don’t want politicians making bad deals like the one Thompson made.

by Titan52 on Oct 27, 2011 10:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'd be more angry about it if I weren't a Sox fan.

I already pay for game tickets, food and clothes.

To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch

by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Oct 27, 2011 11:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't live in Chicago so I don't care.

I am assuming this only hits Chicagoans or Cook Countians…if not…if its extends into my little sphere, then I am pissed.

by Rhubarb on Oct 27, 2011 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

it's not called the chicago sports facility authority

or the cook county sports facility authority, is it.

by larry on Oct 27, 2011 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

the above was a larry specific whoosh trap

kind of like putting cheese in a trap for mice and a carcass in a trap for hyenas…(now I’m pissed!)

by Rhubarb on Oct 27, 2011 2:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but he'd have to butt heads with that guy who dresses up as Soxman.

it just makes me weak in the knees the way gomez neither fixed or removed his crooked ass helmet after that puntoslide. -Trooper on Oct 5, 2011

by South Side Expat on Oct 27, 2011 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

It went like this:

Jim: Hi Jerry. My term at the ISFA is almost over. Is there anything else I can do for you before I’m gone?

Jerry: Well, now that you mention it…

Jim: You got it!

WU got his ass handed to him by the Shit Rooster, of all people! Priceless.
Chiburb is an assclown. A real life loser and internet bore.

Mick11's SBN profile.

by Chiburb on Oct 27, 2011 8:54 AM CDT up reply actions  

Perhaps I am misinterpreting JR's business tactics and practices...

but does this mean he’ll eventually find a way to make the players foot the bill for Rios and Dunn?

Little Bighorn. Classic small sample size. -Skancho Danza

by keystone connection on Oct 27, 2011 8:39 AM CDT reply actions  

thats lota mulla

2011 WhiteSox Baseball: we're all in

by OznCoop on Oct 27, 2011 8:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

New bullpen phones

It's 106 miles to Chicago, we have a full tank of gas, 1/2 pack of cigarettes...it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses.

by lastof12 on Oct 27, 2011 9:17 AM CDT reply actions  

I'm a little irked by all this attention Holland is getting for his pitching performance the other night.

Yes, fine, he pitched more than 8 innings in the WS for the first time since 2003. But no one anywhere has mentioned that Freddy Garcia came pretty darn close in 2005 with 8 full innings. KenWo, amiright?!

To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch

by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Oct 27, 2011 9:23 AM CDT reply actions  

(Burries face in hands). Never mind.

To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch

by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Oct 27, 2011 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

*one 'r'

To my knowledge, certain things were not known.
-James Murdoch

by 2ndHalfAdjustments on Oct 27, 2011 9:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

Freddy never got his dues

2011 WhiteSox Baseball: we're all in

by OznCoop on Oct 27, 2011 9:53 AM CDT up reply actions  

i was 3.

turned 4 that november. i remember that team. i remember being at the games. i remember going on the field after the clincher.

Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.

by KenWo4LiFe on Oct 27, 2011 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

i think i would try and steal

off of Dotel if I were ever in a situation where he was ordered to ibb a batter and i were on base…it will be interesting to see if anyone ever attempts that

"Statistics are about as interesting as first base coaches" Jim Bouton

by Grinder Rule #42 on Oct 27, 2011 10:31 AM CDT reply actions  

Steal second?

Am I missing something? When the walk is completed you’re going to end up on second anyway

Reporter: I was wondering if at any point in my lifetime the Cubs weren't going to be run by a guy who didn't immediately remind me of failure, confusion, or imminent death

by Hazymania on Oct 27, 2011 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's saying steal on ball 2 or 3.

"Many people need desperately to receive this message: 'I feel and think much as you do, care about many of the things you care about, although most people do not care about them. You are not alone.'"

by U-God on Oct 27, 2011 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's saying he would try to take 3rd.

The IBB isn’t issued if he’s on 1st.

by 3E8 on Oct 27, 2011 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

unless ron washington is managing.

"michael gilhaney is an example of a man that is nearly banjaxed from the principal of the atomic theory. would it astonish you to hear that he is nearly half a bicycle?" ~~ sergeant pluck

by BuehrleMan on Oct 27, 2011 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

true. fail.

Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.

by KenWo4LiFe on Oct 27, 2011 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

exactly...

and I think the runner has the edge with A.) how slow the pitch is coming and B.) the catcher having to focus on both the runner and the crappy slow one hopper

"Statistics are about as interesting as first base coaches" Jim Bouton

by Grinder Rule #42 on Oct 27, 2011 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

never been a reinsdorf fan. still not now.

Some people get so rich they lose all respect for humanity. That's how rich I want to be.

by MarketMaker on Oct 27, 2011 12:33 PM CDT reply actions  

Reinsdorf is a good business man, got a good deal

And is a rare example of a rich guy who actually did help create jobs. Also, Bridgeport is becoming a nice neighborhood and had some great places to eat and drink. I am sure the Sox play a role as well.

The whole “cheapest man in sports” moniker is total BS, and I think his ethnicity plays a role in it sadly.

by 815Sox on Oct 27, 2011 1:19 PM CDT reply actions  

"La Russa is the sort of man who wants a left-handed waiter to serve chicken and fish and a righty to serve beef."

Heh, that’s very good. Thanks for linking.

Also, does this mean I can’t complain as much about the proposed Wrigley financing? Because I probably will anyway.

The policeman who jumps from a bridge to a plane is Detective John McClane, a.k.a. Bruce Willis. He’s just the star of the whole movie series and stuff, no big deal or anything. -Cruiser

by Uribe Down on Oct 27, 2011 4:06 PM CDT reply actions  

Just cause JR got to screw the taxpayers, it's okay for Ricketts to do it as well?

plus, moving the Cubs from Wrigley isn’t anywhere near a credible threat.

it just makes me weak in the knees the way gomez neither fixed or removed his crooked ass helmet after that puntoslide. -Trooper on Oct 5, 2011

by South Side Expat on Oct 27, 2011 5:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Money

The Cell was built for $120 million dollars. The new Soldiers Fieldls was built for $630 million dollars. Who got the better deal? Is anybody going to tell me that the new Soldiers Field has been worth the money that was spent on it? If the new restaurant at the Cell was built with the hotel taxes paid by the out of towners, so what?

by WBWSF on Oct 28, 2011 11:41 AM CDT reply actions  

One reason the conventions are leaving the city in droves, they are fed up -

extra rental car tax, extra hotel tax, etc., etc., etc.

My serenity is inversely proportional to my expectations.

LET’S GO YOU WHITE SOX!!!!!

by ballyb on Oct 28, 2011 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Trying to do anything at McCormick is a joke these days.

it just makes me weak in the knees the way gomez neither fixed or removed his crooked ass helmet after that puntoslide. -Trooper on Oct 5, 2011

by South Side Expat on Oct 28, 2011 5:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

lots of shit still goes through rosemont though.

you can have a convention, stay at a nice hotel, go to the casino, eat at mortons or gibsons and be 5 minutes from the airport.

if i was going to have a convention id rather hold it there than in the city.

Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.

by KenWo4LiFe on Oct 29, 2011 11:58 AM CDT up reply actions  

they're not really competitors. rosemont is a 900k square feet. mccormick is 2.7m.

size is what makes mccormick place. largest in the country. if you’re hosting a major convention, there are essentially three choices: chicago, vegas and orlando. and vegas is a pretty significant amount smaller than mccormick.

by larry on Oct 29, 2011 12:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, and for all our money we got

The Last Bad Baseball Park built in America.

My serenity is inversely proportional to my expectations.

LET’S GO YOU WHITE SOX!!!!!

by ballyb on Oct 28, 2011 4:02 PM CDT reply actions  

Who dis?

The sun on the balcony is almost unbearable, worse than the booing fans in Chicago shedding miserable light on his failures at work.

by winningugly on Oct 28, 2011 8:25 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions  

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