Twitter says John Danks, White Sox agree to extension
by Jim Margalus on Dec 21, 2011 6:43 PM CST
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PrintUPDATE (8:00 p.m.): Jon Heyman confirms: "danks and white sox agree on $65M, 5-yr deal. looks like some fan had it first. lol"
* * *
We've been following the White Sox offseason with the belief that John Danks was on the trading block. Perhaps we've been led astray.
On Twitter, @k0na tweeted the following:
#WhiteSox danks signs a big contract with the sox. repeat. big.- #WhiteSox Danks signs a pretty big contract with the Sox. It's big...
- #Whitesox 5yr 65mil
Why should we believe @k0na that John Danks has signed a five-year, $65 million extension? Because he's the guy who told us that Edwin Jackson and Mark Teahen were headed to Toronto for Jason Frasor before anybody else, and he has a couple of other trades under his belt, too -- Jon Garland for Orlando Cabrera, and the first Jake Peavy trade.
When he tweeted the Jackson trade in July, I put it at the bottom of a longer post. But given his background, let's give this some front-page play and see if it holds up. Since he doesn't seem to post bad rumors or incorrect news, let's start thinking this out.
If anything more happens tonight, we'll be updating it.
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Do you want this to be true? I thought he would certainly be traded, but maybe I wasn’t reading the right information. Guess we shall see.
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Thats what happens when certain teams lowball us.
Boom. Steak. Dinner.
It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity
by Rhubarb on Dec 21, 2011 6:58 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Probably 4yrs 65m guaranteed
5th yr option worth 3m. So he’s paid an avg of 15.5 in 2012-2015.
by striker on Dec 21, 2011 6:54 PM CST via mobile reply actions
It's reported 5 year $65m deal
1. I doubt the Sox guarantee anyone 5 years
2. I doubt Danks takes an average salary of $13m
So I’m guessing that it’s 4 years guaranteed with a 5th option year (5 years). $65m guaranteed but could be more if the 5th year option is picked up. Think…
2012 $12m
2013 $15m
2014 $17m
2015 $17m
2016 $18m option with $4m buyout
That makes more sense than an average of $13m per year.
it really doesn't.
you’re saying john danks signed a contract with a guaranteed average annual salary of $16.25 million. i like danks and all but he shouldn’t be among the top ten or so starting pitchers in salary. particularly since he’s not a free agent and has a year left in arbitration.
Yeah, I'll be curious to see how the specifics of the contract shake out.
Buehrle and Wilson set the bar pretty high, so it should be interesting to compare.
It makes sense
1. The Sox don’t have a pitcher guaranteed past 2012 (Gavin has an option).
2. Buehrle is gone so there is no one to anchor the rotation.
3. The return in the trade market probably wasn’t worth it.
4. You have Peavy and Pierzynski coming off the books after 2012, Konerko after 2013, Dunn and Rios after 2014. So there is money available later.
5. One of Quentin/Thornton will probably be traded this winter.
You're really throwing 'probably' around liberally. It's a lot of unjustified assumption.
Some people get so rich they lose all respect for humanity. That's how rich I want to be.
I'm going off Kenny saying they still need to cut some payroll
Quentin makes the most sense with us having 4 outfielders. Thornton’s name has also come up.
Ventura: "Until it's actually told to me you can't really believe it."
White Sox Talk: She needs premium, dude! PREMIUUUUM! DUUUUUDE!
jon heyman is confirming deal.
says it won’t be announced until after christmas because danks hasn’t (and won’t) take a physical until then.
Just saw this on Twitter.
Props to MLBTradeRumors, they actually gave this guy on Twitter credit for breaking the story. I’ll be curious to see how the deal shakes out. Will also be curious to see what they do with the rest of the rotation starting in 2013 (post-Peavy). Figuring Danks, Sale and probably Molina. Do you try to keep Floyd now and maybe Humber? That seems like a pretty solid 5 depending on how Sale and Molina develop.
Yeah saw that.
Haha have to wonder who this guy’s source is. I assume he’s just a fan right?
i'm game
"There's too many (bleeping) guys on the computer. It's simple. I say that. Pete Rose never watched a computer. Rod Carew never did. All those hitters, they go out and see the ball, hit it and move on." - Ozzie
by usualsuspect on Dec 21, 2011 8:44 PM CST up reply actions
I'm still waiting for tenfootmidget to get the credit.
"Many people need desperately to receive this message: 'I feel and think much as you do, care about many of the things you care about, although most people do not care about them. You are not alone.'"
He's already home and doesn't want to interfere with his xmas plans I'll bet
It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity
Last minute flights to Chicago are expensive right before Christmas.
The lords of dawn are men such as Mr. Lucy.
let him remain semi mythical
I like the thought that k0na is out there, mysteriously and seemingly inexplicably knowing things before everyone else every few months. Like the Haley’s comet of Sox info
by Titan52 on Dec 21, 2011 10:12 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Did not see this coming.
Once it looked like he might not be traded, I thought for sure he was going to leave in free agency. That said, I’m very excited if it’s true.
"That baseball is the smartest thing out on that field." —Hawk Harrelson
Big surprise, Keith Law doesn't like it.
via Twitter: “If you’re rebuilding, you trade Danks. If you re-sign Danks, you’re not rebuilding. If you re-sign Danks while rebuilding, you’re lost.”
so...
So if you’re rebuilding you should trade away your young talent and ride it out with the old guys? It would be different if they extended AJ for 3 more years or gave Konerko another extension. I think the move makes sense whether you are rebuilding or not, unless larry tells me otherwise.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Dec 21, 2011 8:25 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Ass head
keithlaw (@keithlaw)
12/21/11 8:18 PM
Ozzie just keeps looking better RT @DarkestDiamond: @keithlaw Danks re-signs with the White Sox? What happened to rebuilding?
12/12/07- We'll miss you Andy Gonzalez
by The Deacon on Dec 21, 2011 8:25 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
If you are rebuilding, you sign good pitchers to contracts
that will cover rebuilding years. Like 5 of them.
FKL.
by South Side Expat on Dec 21, 2011 8:44 PM CST up reply actions
Do I really need to say it?
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
lol nods head
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
Where does this put us on salary now? With a "rebuild".
Trying to get below 100m seems pretty remote. No one counted on this. All previous ideas are out the window regarding direction of offseason.
It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity
maybe tinfoil-hatted
but that’s an awfully palatable contract… it’s been mentioned that he could be more attractive now than with only a year of control.
???
Does this mean no Cuban outfielder?
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Dec 21, 2011 8:40 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
i'm not sure why this is necessarily seen as a totally different direction.
speculation was one of danks or floyd would be traded. now it looks like maybe floyd is the one. considering his contract, he may well have been the more attractive trade piece.
and, purely speculation, but i’d guess the contract is $10M, $12M, $13M, $14M, and $16M. i wouldn’t take the 5/$65M report as that’s what the guaranteed portion is. it may well be 4 years with the 5th as an option.
i smell sign and trade
danks’ cost figure is now controlled for 5 years so they can leverage that to get better prospects. and remember jerry’s position on not giving pitchers more than 3 years? he did it once for buehrle but now he is suddenly going to go to 5 years for a pitcher on a team that is rebuilding? something is fishy…
given what we've seen with pitchers the last few offseasons
why would it make sense for danks to sign a deal that doesn’t have 5 guaranteed years?
he loves the sox
wanted to take the deal floyd ended up taking then his agent talked him out of it… some (i admit very few) players actually dont mind not getting top dollar or length of contract if they really like where they are at
no. john danks is not a free agent.
pitchers signed to extensions that kick in after their second arbitration season. like chad billingsley. or wandy rodriguez.
i understand he's not a free agent
but why would danks and his agent not view wilson as a comparable and his contract as a measuring stick?
amazing that this
is the largest deal for a pitcher in team history
am i not writing in english?
he’s not a free agent. his comparables are chad billingsley and wandy rodriguez. they got 3 years guaranteed. i’d be skeptical that danks got 5 years.
was i writing in greek
when i said “i understand he’s not a free agent?”
you don't understand. if you did, you wouldn't be going on about how crazy it is that i posited that maybe his contract is for a number of years between his direct comparables and a less direct comparable.
by larry on Dec 21, 2011 9:21 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
is your brain capable of understanding
since 2008 john danks: 15.6 WAR, wandy rodriguez 11.7 WAR. If that is a direct comparable then…WOW. Clearly you choose to be simplistic in your thought process and not believe an agent would look at a a guy like CJ Wilson who’s been a starter for 2 years and say “hey my client has proven himself as a starter for twice as long with similar results.” but hey apparently i’m too simple…
I think
He is speaking more in terms of market comparables, since that is what is being discussed here. Danks’ situation is not the same as CJ Wilson. Why is this happening.
and what i'm saying is
markets change. agents see contracts players get in the current market and will also use that as a measuring stick and not just limit themselves to markets that were established in previous years. to suggest that an agent wouldn’t try to upsell his client and get more favorable terms (whether it be dollars or guaranteed years) than previous markets would have warranted isn’t realistic.
There was only one team Danks could negotiate with this offseason.
1 bidder vs. who knows how many.
Some people get so rich they lose all respect for humanity. That's how rich I want to be.
by MarketMaker on Dec 21, 2011 11:11 PM CST up reply actions
ah, yes. i love it when people just happen to cite the timeframes that support their view.
you wouldn’t want to leave out that aberrant 2008 season for danks.
three seasons prior to signing their respective contracts: danks, 10.4 fWAR. rodriguez, 10.2 fWAR. why did i use the three years prior? because those are the years one uses when projecting players.
I'll have u know I cited 2008
because that was the first year Danks pitched the entire season in the rotation (if you would like we can include 2007 when he didn’t pitch past mid August).
or however else you would like
since clearly i’m clueless
sure you did.
and what was the reason you included the season after wandy signed his contract? because that was simpler for you?
again, i chose to use 2008 as a starting point
because that was the first time both pitchers went a full season in the rotation. i guess i should’ve included a picture…
billingsly
didnt he sign two years away from free agency?
it was an extension. didn't replace 1 year contract agreed to avoid 2nd arbitration.
hence the choice of wording: “pitchers signed to extensions that kick in after their second arbitration season.”
so is it not reasonable to
start the comparison between 2 pitchers when they both go a full season in their respective rotations?
I got this Larry...
No. They were under two totally different contract situations. It would be like comparing D. Rose’s extension to LeBron signing with the Heat.
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
um
“and what was the reason you included the season after wandy signed his contract?”
Basically, Danks and Wandy signed extensions one year apart. Therefore, you have to use the 3 seasons before they signed their respective extensions in order to be consistent. So for Danks that is 09, 10, and 11, whereas for Wandy it is 08, 09 and 10. So you can’t include 08 for Danks or 11 for Wandy.
i told you why i wouldn't do it.
but if you’re going to, it certainly shouldn’t be weighted anywhere near as much as the ensuing three seasons.
hey, look! he asks me a question. and i immediately and directly respond to it. even when he refuses me the same courtesy. i must really be the dumbfuck he thinks i am.
a little exaggerated there larry
never did the word dumbfuck come from my keyboard. i clearly stated, i used, admittedly, a very simple starting point of the 2008 season which was the first time danks went an entire season in the rotation for the sake of my comparison between the two. for the sake of my comparison, i was not taking the 3 seasons prior to wandy signing his extension into consideration, that was not my criteria. it was solely based on a timeframe when both were full-time members of their rotations, which for danks did not happen until 2008.
clearly yours wasn't a direct comparison
but that was because you chose a flawed timeframe for said comparison.
Smell, think, predict whatever you want
I’m not surprised by this AT ALL.
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
Suprised
My sense was that Danks was resistant to a deal and was interested in testing the market.That appears to be not the case.Most of us would rather see him in Chicago than elsewhere.
I'd say most of actions were such that he was open to a deal.
Starting with the changing of his agent. I just think he felt he was worth more that the Sox were willing to offer at a given point and he had time to increase his value.
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
I thought he was gone
so this is good news!
NAOPOS
by blackoutsox on Dec 21, 2011 11:29 PM CST up reply actions
sign and trade?
teams weary about controlling danks after next year? not anymore.
"There's too many (bleeping) guys on the computer. It's simple. I say that. Pete Rose never watched a computer. Rod Carew never did. All those hitters, they go out and see the ball, hit it and move on." - Ozzie
Wgerw is the Kenny the Ninja gif?
by southsideirish on Dec 21, 2011 8:46 PM CST via mobile reply actions
Nice
Said from the start it made little sense not to keep danks and use the money coming off the books next yaer to finance it. 27 year old lefties with his workload, ability to pitch in the al and at a park like the cell dont grow on trees… well done whitesox.
agreed
You gotta have at least one guaranteed starter in your rotation. Danks was our best option.
Clearly Kenny valued Danks more than other GMs did
And clearly Kenny has Jerry’s ear to secure Danks rather than get back a less-than-desirable set of assets in trade.
This, taken with the Santos trade, is a mixed message about the team’s future. That said, I understand Kenny’s thinking here, even if I disagree with it.
We now have our anchor
at least it seems like thats what Kenny wants to do. I think Danks and Sale make a good 1-2 punch at the top of the rotation.
They won't bever be 1-2.
Gotta separate the lefties.
"That baseball is the smartest thing out on that field." —Hawk Harrelson
You know about Danks' career splits right?
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
by colintj on Dec 21, 2011 10:01 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
Well sure.
But does any manager in the world care?
"That baseball is the smartest thing out on that field." —Hawk Harrelson
There's a theory regarding Danks...
Some people get so rich they lose all respect for humanity. That's how rich I want to be.
by MarketMaker on Dec 21, 2011 11:14 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I cannot decide whether I like the idea of rebuilding or not.
And apparently Kenny doesn’t either. Seems like a good deal though for the Sox.
Packers Season
SSS minds come together today and BAM action is taken.
will be interesting to see the annual breakdown.
by the way they still have money to sign Cespedes.
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
Check your email.
"Many people need desperately to receive this message: 'I feel and think much as you do, care about many of the things you care about, although most people do not care about them. You are not alone.'"
you can find people saying anywhere from 30-60.
hopefully he’s friendly with dayan or alexei and they help sway him. All of the things that people liked about minoso I can see in this guy. He’d be a perfect guy for the Sox who are in desperate need of someone exciting.
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
i don't think Quentin is valued all that much anyway.
yes Quentin would be moved for sure… but that probably is going to happen anyway.
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
based on scouting reports
is he rated similar to alexei and dayan in regards to his plate discipline or lack thereof?
no question
but when he first came up he had none. i’m just curious how cespedes is viewed in this regard
you hit yourself off the island. not walk.
so i’m assuming its somewhere near the two of them.
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
it's similar, perhaps somewhat better, than ramirez's was. viciedo isn't a good comp because he was much younger than the two 26 year olds
or alleged 26 year olds. from dan szymborski
While projecting based on Cuban stats can be tricky for some of the reasons I outlined above, ZiPS nailed the Alexei Ramirez projection when he signed with the White Sox a few years ago. For 2008 through 2011, ZiPS projected that Ramirez’s line would be .269 AVG/.316 OBP/.418 SLG , and his actual line was .279/.323/.421. So that gives us some hope for the Cespedes projection.
Based on Cespedes’ Cuban career, ZiPS suggests that his profile is similar to players such as Kevin McReynolds, Mike Devereaux and Aaron Rowand. And going forward, it’s not hard to see why Cespedes is so sought after. ZiPS projects him to be clearly better than any center fielder on the market, and while he doesn’t project to be a star in any individual season, he may be able to catch that label in his better seasons.
since it’s insider, i won’t post the full career projection but 2012 is representative of his peak years and it obviously declines per usual from there.
.270/.331/.435 3.3 WAR
http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/7298446/mlb-statistical-projections-yoenis-cespedes
hunk of salt, of course.
absolutely. just take a look at his youtube videos.
but don’t fall in love. he’s mine.
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
Tdogg is the conductor of that train.
Some people get so rich they lose all respect for humanity. That's how rich I want to be.
by MarketMaker on Dec 21, 2011 11:16 PM CST up reply actions
Is that a good or bad thing?
GET TO THE CHOPPA!!!
by hoosier3 on Dec 21, 2011 11:51 PM CST via mobile up reply actions
What hell do you think?
:-) It’s marvelous.
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
last train i conducted this hard was Alexei
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
can we stop with the train metaphors?
inferstructure
It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity
Thats funny
but cmon I didn’t drive a summer long campaign about Hanie. No comparison. And I apologized.
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
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