Whither De Aza?
This just in: the White Sox have a serious Alex Rios problem. The guy is owed about $4M for the rest of this season and $38M from 2012 until Kenny can mercifully buy Rios out at the end of the 2014 season. This wouldn't be such a big deal if he were even somewhat productive. A ball player is worth his salary because his runs scored on offense and runs saved on defense are combined worth a number of wins which in turn generates revenue for the club. As long as the player's salary is equal to or less than his revenue, the club makes money off the player and everyone is happy.
Obviously, the White Sox are not making money off of Rios. In fact, they're in trouble. See, he's been worse than nearly every major leaguer currently in possession of a roster spot and probably a decent number of minor leaguers. Yeah, he was way better last year, but in '09 he had a similar problem. Not to the same extent, but 2 years out of 3 is a meaningful trend.
Since 2009, he's been worth about 1 win every 600 times to the plate. Most major league teams already have a guy who can play CF and produce at that level. And odds are that guy is getting paid somewhere between the league minimum and $5M to do it. The most anyone is paying for that kind of production is what you can get on the free agent market. Lately, that kind of production is going for somewhere between $4-6M. That's $6-8M less than Rios made this year.
So he's been worth about 1 win per season over the last 3. And the Sox will be paying him as if he's worth 2-2.5 wins. If Rios' true talent level is 1 win this year, then just thanks to aging, he'll be worth less and less as the contract goes on. If there's no difference at all between him and a replacement level player, then the Sox may as well just release him because they'll have to eat the whole salary just to get another team to take him on anyway. Given a typical aging pattern, we could expect him to be replacement level as of 2013. Even if the Sox can trade him, they're very very likely to be on the hook for anything he's owed from 2013 onward. Instead of the 4 or so wins that might have been worth in those seasons, the Sox will pay $26M for nothing.
And actually, it gets worse. Rios has a clause in his contract that raises the value of what he's owed $500K per year if he's traded. That's nothing right? Well, yeah. But it's an insult-to-injury issue. See, $500K is more or less the league minimum, which is what a team would have to pay to get a replacement level player if it were ditching another player. So after badly overpaying on Rios, if the Sox trade him, they'll be paying double on his replacement too. Which is nice.
But so in theory, it's possible to trade Rios to a team that thinks he's worth something above replacement for some significant period of time. The question is, who are you going to find? It's fairly common for human beings to overrate the significance of those results which are most recent and Rios' most recent results are mind-searingly bad. Even a hyper-rational human is going to be wary of a guy that makes every pitcher look like Bugs Bunny squaring off against the Gas House Gorillas. So, really, who are you going to convince without giving Rios a ton of playing time to work off his debt?
In that case, the best way to treat Rios' contract is as a sunk cost. Write it in pen on the balance sheet: the Sox will be on the hook no matter what for Rios' salary. And in that case, they need to figure out if Rios can outproduce de Aza (or whomever they can get for the league minimum) over the life of Rios' deal. If they think Rios can be a 1 win or so player well off into the future, then they should stick with him. It's the only way to convince another team he might be worth trading for and he's very likely better than the alternative player. If not, they're totally under water on the deal and they'll have to pay the whole thing no matter what. Trading him would only add to how much they'd owe. So release Rios and let de Aza take over full time.
Which is what y'all rabble rousers are clamoring for no doubt. But there is a reason why de Aza's in Charlotte rather than, say, Seattle or Kansas City. Whatever you think of him, most guys with his profile aren't to be relied upon for one reason or another. In de Aza's, health is probably the most significant factor. This makes him a much better prospect on the Sox than it does the average team, and it's one of the reasons the Sox picked him up I'm sure. Still, it's a closer call than we'd like to believe it is and there is a logic behind continuing to play Rios. At this point, it's presumably because they've had almost two seasons to figure out what they think Rios is capable of producing and more than a half of one to look at de Aza. If they don't think they know what they've got at this point, then they never will and we're worse off than we thought we were.
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I like the caption under it.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
Pierce's expression on the wall is one of disgust.
White Sox 2011: The season of extraneous body parts.
we all have our own ways of coping with
crotch in the face.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
"If they don't think they know what they've got at this point, then they never will and we're worse off than we thought we were"
Meaning they aren’t sure about DeAza, Rios, or both?
Sorry to step on your line, but it isn’t clear to me.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
both
all i was trying to say is if we see de Aza handed the job in mid August, that’s a month or more—depending on your standard for how long it should take to scout de Aza thoroughly—wasted on Rios. which suggests they’re second-guessing themselves and aren’t sure if they trust their scouts. which means we’re really in trouble.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
Thx. Though I see why they'd be on the fence for the $$ on the line.
But the -1.5 WAR, including -.04 DWAR, says DeAza should be here now. As larry has pointed out, it’s not like he wasn’t a real prospect. And as you point out, he should be ridden while healthy.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
Further, I'd keep Rios on the bench and use him in 'situations' perhaps. And as Q's defensive caddy.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
This year.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
he definitely looks like he's taking his offensive struggles into the field
i’m not sure if he’s actually gotten a lot slower or he’s just mentally distracted. but i really don’t know what to think about him personally. without a real feeling personally, i look to the projection systems. and they’re going to ream him pretty good. i’m pretty sure if he keeps up this amount of suck through the end of the year, they’ll have him as a tick above replacement level.
the one thing i do suspect about Rios is that he’s capable of much higher highs than basically any of the replacement level options even if on average they were basically the same.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
it is not heartening
to look at the similar players for rios on baseball reference and note that the majority of them were done by their early 30s (and, yes, i know the efficacy of those things are debatable and should be used for amusement/horror’s sake only).
i remember when people were comparing rios to dave winfield.
what in the hell happened.
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
The Mr. May nickname was at least apt last season.
"Many people need desperately to receive this message: 'I feel and think much as you do, care about many of the things you care about, although most people do not care about them. You are not alone.'"
Dave Winfield got better.
sideways smiley face
by TasteeFreeze on Jul 26, 2011 3:46 PM CDT up reply actions
Only slightly OT, did you read the piece on Igawa (RR)?
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
Rios smirks and gives you the money sign at that comment
Where the white women at?
by parkernutws05 on Jul 26, 2011 2:39 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
the finger thing means the taxes!

So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
by colintj on Jul 26, 2011 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs
i hit preview
and it looked reasonable to me.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
I'm seeing resized to 375 on mine.
Whales! Squids! Sharks! They're everywhere! Hello, I am Poseidon! Now, when people told me I was crazy that thinly sliced roast beef would be a delicious fast-food option, I knew it was the greatest idea, and you can thank me later for Arby's.
by Jim Margalus on Jul 26, 2011 3:20 PM CDT up reply actions
huh. browser?
<div id=“comment_body_72777462” class=“cbody”>
<p><img src=“http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/colintj/Screenshot2011-07-26at34436PM.png” /></p>
<div class=“sig”><p>So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.</p></div>
</div>
I love seasons too. That's why I live in a place that skips the shitty ones.
by thatshortkid on Jul 26, 2011 3:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Firefox 5
When I click image info, dimensions read: 573px × 429px (scaled to 500px × 374px)
Whales! Squids! Sharks! They're everywhere! Hello, I am Poseidon! Now, when people told me I was crazy that thinly sliced roast beef would be a delicious fast-food option, I knew it was the greatest idea, and you can thank me later for Arby's.
by Jim Margalus on Jul 26, 2011 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions
ah so......
you may have “browser.enable_automatic_ image_resizing = true” in your about:config
I love seasons too. That's why I live in a place that skips the shitty ones.
by thatshortkid on Jul 26, 2011 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Thanks for the tip
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain
it was worth it
to mention the funniest thing that happens in season 6.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
I would have that debate.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
by colintj on Jul 26, 2011 7:16 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Sounds like Rios has a good agent.
I didn’t realize that the Sox were on the hook for that much dough.Before he came to Chicago, all I knew was that he was some guy from the Blue Jays who I was unimpressed by in the Home Run Derby a few years ago.(Hard to believe that he made the All Stars) Nobody wants him so I guess use him for late inning defensive purposes, a la Dewayne Wise. But for cripes sake, get him out of the starting lineup.
Ummm didn't Bugs Bunny smoke the Gas House Gorillas?
Then the statue of liberty called the last guy out. He won that game. Fair and square.
by ScottyPods Ver2.0 on Jul 26, 2011 2:48 PM CDT reply actions
It's all here:
http://www.ussmariner.com/2006/03/12/bugs-bunny-greatest-banned-player-ever/
Whales! Squids! Sharks! They're everywhere! Hello, I am Poseidon! Now, when people told me I was crazy that thinly sliced roast beef would be a delicious fast-food option, I knew it was the greatest idea, and you can thank me later for Arby's.
by Jim Margalus on Jul 26, 2011 2:53 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
I'm like a quarter of the way through it and I had to stop,
I just keep laughing, and everyone at work is getting curious. I’ll have to read the rest at home.
by ScottyPods Ver2.0 on Jul 26, 2011 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Hahahaha
We are then introduced to the shabby state of both the grounds keeping and of stadium security at the Polo Grounds, as we see an angry rabbit (Bugs Bunny, RHP/UT) is able to heckle the visiting team from left field, where he has dug a fairly substantial hole, and is enjoying a carrot-dog and (it appears) has consumed a large bottle of wine through a straw. Illustration 4: Evidence of lax security and groundskeeping
by ScottyPods Ver2.0 on Jul 26, 2011 3:09 PM CDT up reply actions
It has been so long since I had seen that
I completely forgot about it. One of my favorites as a kid.
lmao
It’s a further testament to the addled mental condition of the Teatotallers during this drubbing that they were unable to take advantage of the congested baserunning by fielding any ball and throwing it to any base, where it would have immediately forced out three runners and ended the inning.
"You go up there, against a dog-ass line up AND pitcher, and you don’t do a fucking thing with it. They whip your silly, sorry, saggy ass AGAIN, and you look like fucking bottom-ass, bitch-ass chumps doing it." - 2HA
by Shoeless In SC on Jul 26, 2011 7:39 PM CDT up reply actions
right, i was thinking of the "1..2..3 yer out! 1..2..3 yer out! 1..2..3 yer out!" bit
that danged slow ball worked like a charm.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
funny thing is....
halfway through i glanced over at the RR….
“Forget Chicago Tough – Rios is Chicago Good”
Maybe he meant chicago cubs good….
correct
and it also has nothing to do with cheat
Turns out that was the very peak of his White Sox career.
Whales! Squids! Sharks! They're everywhere! Hello, I am Poseidon! Now, when people told me I was crazy that thinly sliced roast beef would be a delicious fast-food option, I knew it was the greatest idea, and you can thank me later for Arby's.
by Jim Margalus on Jul 26, 2011 4:25 PM CDT up reply actions
What's wrong with 1 month out of 4+ years?
"Rooting for the Twins is just a roundabout way of rooting for a first-round playoff bye for the Yankees." by big_fun
Tony Pena out for season. Tommy John surgery recommended.
http://twitter.com/ESPNChiSox/status/95968150767677441
’Twas only a matter of time.
Whales! Squids! Sharks! They're everywhere! Hello, I am Poseidon! Now, when people told me I was crazy that thinly sliced roast beef would be a delicious fast-food option, I knew it was the greatest idea, and you can thank me later for Arby's.
by Jim Margalus on Jul 26, 2011 4:30 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
We had it a couple weeks ago when Larry called it.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
This is disappointing news.
I was hoping that rather than an injury, he was being kept in rehab by common sense.
by mechanical turk on Jul 26, 2011 4:50 PM CDT up reply actions
what, like he's been guarding tony's door or something?
I love seasons too. That's why I live in a place that skips the shitty ones.
by thatshortkid on Jul 26, 2011 6:07 PM CDT up reply actions
all the sox fans around the nation weep at the thought of brandon allen and what could have been
"We saw death and I don't think we fear it anymore. Not unlike 2005, when we finally clinched and then we took off in the playoffs." Coop 7/29/10
Tommy JOhn surgery wouldn't do Brandon Allen much good.
sideways smiley face
by TasteeFreeze on Jul 26, 2011 5:42 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm surprised nobody's pointed this out yet, since this is that type of place.
But wherefeore means “why”, so your title is misleading. What you mean is either “Wherefore Rios?” or “Wherefore not de Aza?” or “Wherefore is de Aza in Charlotte?”
I should also point out that I agree that Rios needs to be treated as a sunk cost. I also think KW is way too stubborn to acknowledge this, degree from Stanford or no.
"The Sox have a better home record than the Twins, but...we're not at home right now." -DJ
by Joist on Jul 26, 2011 4:35 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I'm guessing he meant "Whither"
Whales! Squids! Sharks! They're everywhere! Hello, I am Poseidon! Now, when people told me I was crazy that thinly sliced roast beef would be a delicious fast-food option, I knew it was the greatest idea, and you can thank me later for Arby's.
by Jim Margalus on Jul 26, 2011 4:39 PM CDT up reply actions
wherefore can also mean 'as a result of which',
so, he could be saying ‘rios sucks, ergo de aza, right?’.
though that would need a comma after the ‘wherefore’. so yeah, colin sucks today.
He was going for the Shakespearian tragedy and meant "Wherefore Art Thou DeAza"?
Knowing what he meant, and that he got up before noon to write it, I gave him a pass.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
The only thing in my defense
is that you know what I mean. But yeah that’s pretty lazy at best. I am duly shamed.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
by colintj on Jul 26, 2011 7:12 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
rhubarb inspired me. bringing the kid to the game tonight with my dad.
hopefully peavy doesn’t get hurt for the 84th time since joining the sox. lets get verlander again!
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
Great Article!
Colintj you hit it out of the park for me. Rios is a dog and the only thing I can remember when Kenny picked him up was “how stupid can you be??” from the people who know baseball. Kenny is a desperate man grasping at straws!
time to promote him upstairs
"We saw death and I don't think we fear it anymore. Not unlike 2005, when we finally clinched and then we took off in the playoffs." Coop 7/29/10
Or do you just play one on the Internet?
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
Well it wasnt exactly an obviously stupid
move at the time. His career at that point suggested he could at least be average which is what he’s being paid to be. I saw it as a mid-season free agent signing and I think Jim and Cheat saw the same.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
by colintj on Jul 26, 2011 7:15 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
This.
One of the issues with his declining WAR (and his use by the Blue Jays) was that he was languishing in RF when signs indicated he’d be a plus-plus defender in CF. Of course, that his defensive numbers have regressed along with his bat is not a good sign.
"The Sox have a better home record than the Twins, but...we're not at home right now." -DJ
i don't know about plus plus.
tick above average i’ll give you.
So fast he could hit a ball up the middle and it would hit him in the ass sliding into second.
Can he snap out of it?
Somehow I have been thinking all year that he will. I know that seems pretty foolish at this point. What do you guys think? The only injury I’ve heard about with Rios is the toe thing. He has some ability…………….but I agree that as of right now he is just costing us games with his lack of hitting. Is he redeemable?
"as of right now" has been a full season at least.
Trying to score runs with Juan Pierre as your leadoff hitter is like trying to suture a wound in a moving car. You might still be successful -- but why make it so hard on yourself?
Waiting on a Red Line train
Our manager wears 13, we were supposedly cursed, and we wear black. Let's play.
by ChiSoxRox on Jul 26, 2011 6:17 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
i don't have the fancy mobile device so i just read this now.
and i was in 536 anyway. thanks though.
Kenwo4life=ratings. Just call me Mr. USA Today.
sec 157 but 18
Our manager wears 13, we were supposedly cursed, and we wear black. Let's play.
by ChiSoxRox on Jul 26, 2011 7:07 PM CDT via mobile up reply actions
Therefore, De Aza!
So, I say this more with admiration than anything else: I love that Kenny Williams went out and acquired the two worst players in the American League so far this year. - Joe Posnanski

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