Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Win or Lose, Boston Celtics' New Big 3 Era A Success

Commenting gone awry: A short lesson in Jake Peavy's walk percentage

It began as a simple comment. I thought I could do some baseball-type typing for a change and show that Jake Peavy, when pitching from the stretch (i.e. with men on base) was losing control, as shown by an increase in walks. The comment was well-received, but it wasn't as accurate or in-depth as it should have been. There was no average to compare to, the sample sizes were problematic, and I had forgotten to subtract intentional walks from my numbers. Being somewhat obsessive, I spent some time trying to make it right.

For this comparison, I chose a handful similar-type pitchers, i.e. righties with a large enough sample (this is all non-scientific, of course, and may still be dripping with problems) that have high K% (>20%) and below-average BB% (<8% for the most part). Oh, and Gavin Floyd for relatability. We could look at more pitchers. We could look at other types of pitchers. We could look at pitch selection and location. But we won't; I'm plowing ahead. Pitching from the stretch is another huge tub of owls that I don't intend on opening at the moment. This is only a revised attempt (IBBs for all pitchers were removed) to look at what happens to Peavy's BB% with runners on base. Because strike outs matter somewhat critically in men-on-base situations(plus they're the sister component for FIP), I looked at those trends, too. For simplicity, I'm only posting the walk numbers; the names link to each pitchers' Fangraphs splits page for 2011 if you don't trust my descriptions.

Star-divide

In this sample, Justin Verlander's K% has stayed fairly constant while his BB% has risen with runners on. The exception is last year, when his K% really spiked with runners on, approaching 30%. Recently he's getting the necessary strike outs, but the unintentional walks have risen, too. In earlier years, the K% was a bit lower, but so were the walks.

Verlander Overall BB% BB% w/ runners BB% w/RISP Change in BB%, overall to runners
2011 5.3 7.1 10.2 34%
2010 6.2 9.9 12.8 60%
2009 4.8 7.6 8.7 58%
2008 9.8 7.9 9.5 -19%
2007 7.4 7.4 7.1 0%


Josh Beckett's K% remains remarkably consistent with or without runners on the sacks, the exception being 2011 when it shot up about 6 points to 28.6% with RISP. His constant increase in walks are the most troublesome of this group.

Beckett Overall BB% BB% w/ runners BB% w/ RISP Change in BB%, over all to runners
2011 5.9 7.9 8.0 34%
2010 5.6 9.6 11.4 71%
2009 4.4 8.8 10.4 100%
2008 3.3 6.6 9.0 100%
2007 3.8 6.5 6.2 71%

Tim Lincecum was a rookie in 2007, and so pitched only 146 innings. Starting in 2008, his K% soared and remained consistently high no matter the base situation. As you can see, his walks are actually tending to decrease under pressure. That's some dominant pitching.

Lincecum Overall BB% BB% w/ runners BB% w/ RISP Change in BB%, overall to runners
2011 9.9 7.8 7.8 -21%
2010 8.7 6.4 4.9 -26%
2009 6.9 7.7 8.2 12%
2008 10.8 6.5 8.1 -40%
2007 9.4 10.2 13.7 9%

Javier Vazquez is interesting. His BB% remained surprisingly similar across the board, yet his K% tended to dip just a bit with men on. His biggest jump in walk rate, in 2011, came with a noticeable decrease in strike outs. Perhaps that's not a good sign.

Vazquez Overall BB% BB% w/ runners BB% w/ RISP Change in BB%, overall to runners
2011 4.8 6.0 7.3 25%
2010 9.6 8.0 9.4 -17%
2009 4.4 5.5 5.9 25%
2008 6.4 7.0 6.9 9%
2007 5.1 6.0 5.6 18%

We know Gavin Floyd. 2007 is a small sample, and, while generally trending upward when in trouble, his walk rates don't skyrocket. His K rates stayed within a few points, by and large. Little up, little down, no trends to speak of year-to-year. One thing I did notice, in 2008 and 2011, was that his HR/9 basically doubled with RISP. (Home runs being the other factor in FIP, of course). Very small sample size, but giving up more multi-run long-balls is something that fans watching at home tend to notice.

Floyd Overall BB% BB% w/ runners BB% w/ RISP Change in BB%, overall to runners
2011 4.7 6.5 8.1 38%
2010 7.1 6.3 8.2 -11%
2009 6.6 7.4 8.4 12%
2008 8.4 5.8 6.7 -31%
2007 6.2 5.8 10.3 -6%

Now Peavy. I included ‘04 to ‘06 for a larger sample. For the most part his strike outs dipped with runners on, though they rose to very good heights in the same situation in 2008 and 2009. Recently, the Glass Bulldog's dramatic rise in BB% when concerned about runners looks troublesome. However, that's hard to take too seriously considering the partial seasons and his coping with injuries, not to mention a 5.9% walk rate still being pretty good.

Peavy (revised) Overall BB% BB% w/ runners BB% w/ RISP Change in BB%, overall to runners
2011 3.2 5.9 4.6 84%
2010 4.8 11.2 13.3 133%
2009 6.8 10.6 8.1 56%
2008 8.6 7.6 11.5 -12%
2007 6.8 7.4 9.3 9%
2006 5.1 7.4 7.4 45%
2005 4.2 8.4 8.2 100%
2004 6.1 8.4 10.2 38%

What did I learn? First, intentional walks matter to an extent. Elite pitchers aren't often asked to pitch around anyone. Secondly, an increase in walks is often accompanied by an increase in strike outs when guys are on base. I take that to mean that good pitchers, when in trouble, will challenge hitters. If they fall behind, though, they'll back off; a walk is better than a hit in these situations, remember. Pure speculation on my part, though. Concerning Peavy, his rise in BB% over his career (the part catalogued here, at least) wasn't as drastic compared to some other good and elite pitchers as I originally thought. Whether an increase in walks is due to purported loss of control inherent to pitching from the stretch, nibbling around the plate, or simply added mental stress, that's not for me to say. Like I said, that's a whole other satchel of lambs. Whatever the culprit, though, it should probably be accepted league-wide to some degree (hint: not likely mental stress). We can remember this as a vague generality by quoting Bill Murray in Ghostbusters, when asked where the walks go: "They go up."

Also, as became clear to me, high BB% w/RISP isn't the end times; as you can see, Verlander basically doubled his walk rate the past two years when dealing with runners on second and/or third. I'm thinking that speaks to his command; if he's confident that he can paint the corners, he'll do it. His results during those years have been, well... alright. I guess.

Comment 16 comments  |  2 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Sigh.

I guess SBN doesn’t like spacious, easy-to-read charts. Dammit, auto-formatting.

The lords of dawn are men such as Mr. Lucy.

by Uribe Down on Jan 22, 2012 4:40 PM CST reply actions  

Yes Tigers, please sign Juan Pierre.

"That baseball is the smartest thing out on that field." —Hawk Harrelson

by mikecws91 on Jan 22, 2012 4:46 PM CST reply actions  

There are no simple comments

only simple unfrozen cavemen lawyers

by billyok on Jan 22, 2012 4:51 PM CST reply actions  

TP, thanks for proving Peavy had a bad year

Now I’d like craig to admit he was wrong for the first time in his stubborn Scottish existence. :p

It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity

by Rhubarb on Jan 22, 2012 6:51 PM CST reply actions  

Kyle Williams

Way to disgrace your family.

It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity

by Rhubarb on Jan 22, 2012 8:26 PM CST reply actions   2 recs

here i was looking for this in the RRRR

but yes

brndnprkns: I'm pretty sure the "badass" value of your life is closer to Gigli than The Dark Knight

by whitesoxmatt on Jan 22, 2012 8:38 PM CST up reply actions  

I figured it was on topic

It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity

by Rhubarb on Jan 22, 2012 8:47 PM CST up reply actions  

Stanford and son

It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity

by Rhubarb on Jan 22, 2012 8:53 PM CST up reply actions  

He used to make that same "I didn't do anything!" face in high school.

"Many people need desperately to receive this message: 'I feel and think much as you do, care about many of the things you care about, although most people do not care about them. You are not alone.'"

by U-God on Jan 22, 2012 8:42 PM CST up reply actions  

He said, "you've got to be kidding me."

All instant replay cameras are New York fans

It came from afar and traveled sedately on, a shrug of eternity

by Rhubarb on Jan 22, 2012 8:50 PM CST up reply actions  

only way he'd be worse now is if he traded nick swisher

brndnprkns: I'm pretty sure the "badass" value of your life is closer to Gigli than The Dark Knight

by whitesoxmatt on Jan 22, 2012 9:30 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

~

"Many people need desperately to receive this message: 'I feel and think much as you do, care about many of the things you care about, although most people do not care about them. You are not alone.'"

by U-God on Jan 22, 2012 11:31 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to South Side Sox! Please check our new standards and guide to FanPosts/FanShots before posting.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Archerme_small
The Padded Cell: Wait of the World (part 2 of 2)
61y5zkwuutl__sl500__small
The Ballad of bobpuller
Archerme_small
The Padded Cell: Wait of the World (part 1 of 2)
Tedlangue_small
RRRR: Facebook and socialization
Deadhorse_small
White Sox Minor League Update

Recent FanPosts

Ronkarkovice_small
Don't Stop Now Boys: Sox Double up the Tribe 14-7
Small
Reliever-to-Starter Conversions Update
Small
Is Nate Jones for Real?*
Pair-rose-colored__szo0279_small
A Quarter for your thoughts?
Homersimpson_small
BMO 2027: The Sox Machine Cometh

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

FanShots

Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.

Recent FanShots

Shamelessly Linking My Review of Rick Morrissey's Ozzie Guillen Book
White Sox offer free tickets to CPD officers
A true hitting guru can fix anything
Tweet from Jake Peavy
The White Sox's Black Hole Problem, And Other Observations From A Day Game
Get to the choppa!
Dan Rubenstein heads to Columbus, Ohio to meet Hall of Fame legends Ricky Henderson, Frank Thomas,...
Sox Are Shiftless MFers!
Jake Peavy, AL Pitcher of the Month for the April, is back to 2007 form. While outperforming his preseason projections, is he really up there with the best in baseball? Short answer: yes.

See full post on Beyond the Box Score
A 2 part podcast with Oney Guillen (Ozzie's Son)

+ New FanShot All FanShots >

Yahoo_full_count

Managing Editor

Tedlangue_small Jim Margalus

Editors

Deadhorse_small larry

Sealab_murphy_small colintj

Img_2130_small homesickalien

Omar_small U-God

Authors

10083hb_small KenWo4LiFe

Archerme_small Uribe Down