The OC is a South Sider
Following the 2004 season, back before this place existed, I took part in a series of heated discussions about whether the White Sox should pursue Orlando Cabrera. I was adamantly against it, as the Sox had Juan Uribe, who I felt was every bit the defender as Cabrera and was coming off an .830 OPS season at age 25.
I was right. The Sox didn't have the money to spend $9MM per annum on what was then a similar (perhaps inferior) player. And with the money saved, plus the added flexibility from the Carlos Lee trade, Kenny Williams was able to fill multiple holes to patch together a World Championship club, of which Juan Uribe was key member.
Three years later, however, Uribe has gone south while his waistline expanded, and Cabrera has become one of those players you hate to on the other side of the field. His defense, which seems to grade out as average to above average by most metrics, but well above average by fans and awards voters, remains an asset while his bat is (now) a definite upgrade from Uribe's.
As for the trade itself, I'm sure there are many of you who are upset that the Sox didn't get any youth in this deal; or the return doesn't knock your Sox off.
Kenny had obviously discussed trading Garland or Contreras for Edgar Renteria and a package built around Garland for Bill Hall, both of whom would have been bigger upgrades than Cabrera. That he was unable to complete either of those deals should indicate what Jon Garland was worth to other teams. This is it. This is the best package he could get in return.
The real value in the package may lie in Cabrera and Garland's respective Elias Rankings in one years time. Garland will need to match (or even better) his 2005 season to climb to Type A status while Cabrera, a Type A this off-season, needs to maintain a similar production to his last two years to remain a Type A. As I outlined in my off-season plan, with teams currently holding tightly to their young talent, the best way to rebuild this Sox team is to employ an NBA-like strategy of aquiring expiring contracts of likely Type-A free agents.
Digging a little deeper, the deal appears to be Jon Garland for Orlando Cabrera, $4.5MM in added payroll flexibility, and (as long as Cabrera stays healthy) an extra 2009 draft pick (between 16-75). That's not a bad little haul in what originally looks like a 1-for-1 swap.
As for what the move means for the 2008 team, I'm unsure. No single move can be evaluated in a vaccuum, and Williams can still go in a number of different directions.
The biggest question is now what does he do with Juan Uribe and his $4.5MM contract. I would not be opposed to him sticking around to be the primary backup at 2B, SS, and 3B. Paired with Ozuna, who himself carries a $1MM contract, the Sox would have their infield covered dispatching of Alex Cintron and Andy Gonzalez. $5.5MM may seem like a steep price for a couple of backups, but it shouldn't be a problem for a team which projects to have a $110+MM payroll, and isn't much different than the money they handed to Mackowiak and Cintron in '07.
I'm unenthusiastic about the return of Jose Contreras, but there was not going to be a market for his services. His signing should serve as a reminder as to what happens when signing an over 30 pitcher with a declining strikeout rate.
A rotation of Vazquez, Buehrle, Contreras and two of Danks/Floyd/Gio/Egbert/Broadway probably negates any upgrade the Sox have made at SS, but the added payroll flexibility, probable extra draft pick, and the return from a possible Uribe trade make this an overall win for the Sox. Plus there are still moves to be made, as Kenny Williams hinted to in his statement following the trade.
From the Angels persective, adding Garland to an already deep starting staff may allow them to trade some of their young arms for Miguel Cabrera, which would obviously be a big win for them.
Randomness
- Among active players with at least 25 PA against Jon Garland, Orlando Cabrera trails only Manny Ramirez in OPS. That doesn't include Cabrera's 2-run HR off Garland in game 3 of the '05 ALCS.
- I really had to resist the urge to fill this entry with cliches such as "he's a tough out" and "adept handler of the bat," but the Cabrera of the last two seasons has been just that every time I've seen him play. He's a player I've really grown to appreciate over the past couple of seasons. (Thanks, Uribe.)
- Cabrera doesn't see a lot of pitches, just 3.39 per PA last season and 3.50 for his career, but he makes excellent contact (makes contact on 86% of his swings). He seems to like the ball in off the plate yet has the ability to push the ball off the outside corner into right field. (I'm sure Walker can fix that pesky habit.)
- Cabrera will apparently bat second in the Sox lineup, with which I surprisingly have no problem. That's probably where I'd bat him, in part because of the screwy Elias Rankings which rank plate appearances and batting average as heavily as home runs and OBP.
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nicely said
I think 8 out of their Top 10 prospects in BA's list were pitchers...
by The Wizard on
Nov 19, 2007 4:44 PM CST
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'08
The free agent market for starters is down, and you'd be left with a rotation of Buehrle, Contreras, Danks, Floyd, Gio/Broadway/whoever you can get off the heap in the free agent market.
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 19, 2007 4:52 PM CST
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Yeah, KW is really towing the 2008
by HulkSmash on
Nov 19, 2007 4:55 PM CST
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I think you're
by dantesox on
Nov 19, 2007 7:22 PM CST
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Minaya
If you don't remember, it was Kazmir and Joselo Diaz for Victor Zambrano and Bartoleme Fortunato. OUCH!
by BoKnows on
Nov 19, 2007 4:52 PM CST
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but he needs starters
anyway, the one I really want is lastings
is there any way he does jose + something for lastings alone?
by The Wizard on
Nov 19, 2007 5:02 PM CST
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What are the chances
by ballyb on
Nov 19, 2007 4:55 PM CST
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hunter deal close
by rspata on
Nov 19, 2007 5:31 PM CST
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Thx, Cheat...
I too believe Kenny GM isn't done yet, and if Cowley is touting a Hunter signing I'm encouraged: he's likely wrong. Just closing his eyes and throwing darts, likely to hit a bullseye and hope nobody was counting the misses. After all, he nailed this trade, right?
by Chiburb on
Nov 19, 2007 5:56 PM CST
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one more thought
by Chiburb on
Nov 19, 2007 6:02 PM CST
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Thoughts
by shaftr on
Nov 19, 2007 6:08 PM CST
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more thoughts
by shaftr on
Nov 19, 2007 6:24 PM CST
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Rule 5 draft
...
For the Sox, pitchers Jack Egbert, Adam Russell and Fernando Hernandez must be placed on the 40-man roster or risk being lost in the Rule 5 draft.
by The Wizard on
Nov 19, 2007 6:43 PM CST
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Useless weight still on the 40-man
Alex Cintron
Alex Gonzalez
Removing those three would put the Sox at 34 on the 40-man. I'd be rather dissappointed if Bourgeous is lost because they refuse to remove one of the above three.
by CWSKeith on
Nov 19, 2007 6:47 PM CST
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Well said Cheat
We also dumped Garland's ass and his salary and gives us flexibility with our rotation next spring. (Who here thinks Gio/Egbert/Broadway, field can't put up Garland like numbers???)
by Shoeless In SC on
Nov 19, 2007 6:45 PM CST
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Me, for one
by CWSKeith on
Nov 19, 2007 6:48 PM CST
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Seconded.
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 19, 2007 6:56 PM CST
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Thirded.
by Chiburb on
Nov 19, 2007 7:00 PM CST
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Maybe after a full season in the majors...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 7:52 PM CST
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I will admit
No, I don't expect Gio, Egbert, and Broadway (especially the latter) to put up a 4.25 ERA next season but I do expect them to be close after another year in the bigs. IMO, with one of those 3 replacing Garland, and OC replacing Uribe, we come out ahead.
by Shoeless In SC on
Nov 20, 2007 7:36 AM CST
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How about adding the better Cabrera?
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 7:52 PM CST
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Wow, this guy fell hard...
Diaz, 25, hit nine homers in just 104 at-bats for Texas last season, though that came with a 33/1 K/BB ratio and a .259 OBP. That he has 30-homer upside is undeniable. However, the lack of on-base skills and poor defense in the outfield made him expendable. If he doesn't improve next year, it will be time for him to begin weighing Japan as an option.
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 8:05 PM CST
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The whole picture is really
by dantesox on
Nov 19, 2007 8:13 PM CST
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Uribe...
Besides, if the choice is truly Jerry Owens in LF I think I would rather use some of that $4.5 million of Uribe's salary and sign a cheap LF'er like Shannon Stewart to lead off. If we are going old and expensive, we may as well improve on Jerry Owens.
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 9:08 PM CST
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He's
by dantesox on
Nov 19, 2007 9:17 PM CST
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Do people forget...
Keep dreaming, Hawk. The guy is a hacktastic Tasmanian Devil who swings for the "¡PROFUNDO!" each and every at bat.
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 10:31 PM CST
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If........
by BoKnows on
Nov 19, 2007 9:20 PM CST
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Crede isn't going to net a LF'er...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 10:22 PM CST
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Per Rosenthal
by rebstock on
Nov 19, 2007 10:23 PM CST
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So we net $4.5 million in the trade...
Now dump Uribe's $4.5 million on the Cardinals (who need a SS) and Kenny has $9 million to spend.
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 10:33 PM CST
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Well, it looks like Rosenthal already...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 10:35 PM CST
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Rotoworld knows what's up...
Sources both in the White Sox organization and Torii Hunter's camp have told the Chicago Sun-Times that the two sides could agree to a contract within the week.
It's the type of addition that would put the White Sox back into the mix in the AL Central next year, but it'd also be a long-term deal for a player about to turn 33. Orlando Cabrera is 33, Jermaine Dye turns 34 in January, Paul Konerko turns 32 in March and Jim Thome is 37, giving the White Sox an old offensive nucleus. Nov. 19 - 11:15 pm et
Source: Chicago Sun-Times
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 10:46 PM CST
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I got this quote from SoxTalk...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 11:29 PM CST
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I didn't listen to all of the audio Wiz linked
I can see how they can put a good offense on the field next year, but the medium-term future looks really ugly.
by The Cheat on
Nov 19, 2007 11:08 PM CST
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Also
Apparently, we're counting on Armageddon in 2009.
by The Cheat on
Nov 19, 2007 11:14 PM CST
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Let the speculation begin...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 19, 2007 11:26 PM CST
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So the posts
Can anyone explain guess what has to happen the remainder of the offseason for the Sox to have any chance to be a playoff contender in 2008?
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 19, 2007 11:56 PM CST
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Truthfully they're not far
- Drop Uribe and Crede for bullpen pieces [Use the Towers method of bullpen acquisition] (and/or a LFer)
- Add Hunter and Fukudome.
- Sign the japanese reliever they're after.
The problem is, what the heck will the team look like in 2010? What happens when the same team is coming back a year older and an year less potent in 2009?
Here's an idea of what it will probably look like very soon...
Pos Name 2008 2009 2010 2011
P Buehrle, Mark $14.00 $14.00 $14.00 $14.00
SS Cabrera, Orlando $9.00 $8.00 $8.00 $8.00
P Contreras, Jose $10.00 $10.00
OF Dye, Jermaine $9.50 $11.50 $1.00
OF Erstad, Darin $0.25
C Hall, Toby $1.75 $0.15*
CF Hunter, Torii $14.00 $14.00 $14.00 $14.00
1B Konerko, Paul $12.00 $12.00 $12.00
P MacDougal, Mike $1.95 $2.65 $0.35*
UTL Ozuna, Pablo $1.05 $0.20*
C Pierzynski, A.J. $5.85 $6.25 $6.25
1B Thome, Jim $14.00 $3.00
P Thornton, Matt $0.875 $1.325 $0.25*
P Vazquez, Javier $11.50 $11.50 $11.50
====================
$105.725 $94.575 $67.35 $36.00
====================
Cash (Thome) ($5.00)
Cash (OC) ($1.50)
====================
$99.225 $94.575 $67.35 $36.00
by The Cheat on
Nov 20, 2007 12:25 AM CST
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The Uribe and Crede for relievers trade idea...
Cheat, would the Cardinals give up a reliever like righty Brad Thompson for Uribe to fill their need at SS?
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 12:43 AM CST
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I have no feel for the Cards
I can't really see Uribe bringing back anything of value, even with the Sox throwing in some cash. I think there's a better chance of him remaining with the Sox than finding a suitable trade partner.
by The Cheat on
Nov 20, 2007 12:52 AM CST
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I guess I just figured that the Cardinals need...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 12:56 AM CST
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Well, we still don't know who the prospects were..
Anyways, for the Sox to contend in 2008...
1.) The Sox are apparently set to sign Torii Hunter. This fills our CF void even if Hunter will likely be overpaid and unproductive in the second half of the contract.
2.) The Sox seem like they want to trade Crede to stick Fields at 3B. We would still need to acquire an outfielder via free agency or trade to stick out in LF. Sorry, but Jerry Owens just doesn't do it for me.
3.) The Sox would also need to acquire another starter -- Buehrle and Vazquez is a nice 1-2 but Contreras, Danks, and Floyd is pretty scary. Some posters here have mentioned Fatolo Colon as an option. I have my doubts on Colon staying healthy for an entire season but if he did, he would make an excellent #3 starter.
4.) Finally, Kenny needs to add two more relievers. So far, we have heard about Sox interest in Japanese reliever Yasuhiko Yabuta. Yabuta, along with one more reliever, would do the trick.
Bringing back Jason Bourgeois in a utility bench role would be a smart idea but it wouldn't be a make or break move.
So IMO, that's five new acquisitions that Kenny needs to make for the White Sox to be a contender.
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 12:34 AM CST
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Am I crazy or am I the only one
At this point I think I would like to see Crede stay his final year. Any hope they Sox reconsider and stick Fields back in left for a year? Hell Miggy did it.
by Tdogg on
Nov 20, 2007 12:45 AM CST
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Floyd's last six starts of the season were nice...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 12:54 AM CST
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I don't.
by colintj on
Nov 20, 2007 12:50 PM CST
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so floyd needs a fifth pitch?
i am encouraged by his late season outings to a degree because i think his success may stem from the addition of the slider, which makes his fastball (the pitch that, in my opinion, really hurt him early on) a bit less easy for a hitter to sit on because it looked to me (and this is not from hitter's view, but the TV perspective) that he was throwing it with the same motion as his fastball. basically that - coupled with what i viewed as better and more "consistent" (there it is again) mechanics - made it that much harder for a hitter to pick up what pitch he was throwing. i remember commenting earlier in the year about floyd that i could tell what pitch he was throwing (again, from the tv perspective) what he was throwing before he even released the ball - i wasn't able to do that as "consistently" late in the season.
obviously it's just a small sample size. but i am somewhat confident - certainly moreso than i was in the middle of the year - that gavin can pitch respectably, i.e. like a 4.
by larry on
Nov 20, 2007 3:11 PM CST
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making the cutter sound as valuable as his
i didn't know that he had a slider, let alone learned it somewhat recently. not sure where you got that info, and i'm surprised i didn't hear it/read it in the game threads or something. i did miss his later starts because of school, during which time he threw up a 3.12 ERA, 7.3 K/9, 2.3 BB/9 and, perhaps most importantly, .87 HR/9. A stat line like that says Number 2, but I would really want to compare what he was doing on one side versus the other.
what did he do in those 5 starts to ditch perhaps the one thing that's holding him back from being a #4? was he generating more groundballs?
by colintj on
Nov 20, 2007 5:12 PM CST
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where i got it?
i already told you what he was doing - his mechanics were far superior. he was repeating his delivery and, in my opinion, not tipping his pitches. guys weren't able to recognize his pitches - especially that fastball - as quickly and his better mechanics ensured that he wasn't hanging his curve. thus, more strikeouts, less contact, less good contact, so on.
by larry on
Nov 20, 2007 5:23 PM CST
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ok so the tigers announcing team
As to your bits. First, it's hardly like he had 4 pitches when he came up. He was curveball-fastball, and anything else he threw was rare/bad. For him to add a cutter would have been basically a third. Even as of his last start, he was barely throwing the change. So 5 pitches it's not.
But, I watched all of his 9/5 start, and 2/3 or so of the 9/29 and 7/24 starts. And: the slider is a huge difference. It's a good pitch (I don't know what average vs. plus vs. plus-plus would be), which reinforces his confidence in it and it plays well off his fastball. In the 9/5 start, he was getting a ton of swingnmisses from it and really threw off all of their batters who were clearly sitting fastball. I didn't really see any tipping, but I did see that his fastball is exceptionally straight and he throws very over the top. In other words, he's already throwing a cutter. He's getting like 0 tilt on it (the ball probably spins at or very near 90 degrees), and it's really easy to stay with as a result. It contrasts obviously with the curve, which spins in the exact opposite direction and is slow instead of fast. The slider, instead, is masked by the lack of tilt on the fastball thanks to its own cutting action. Because it's faster and more difficult to recognize, it's set up really well by his fastball.
It was really obvious, imo, that Coop had been working with him. He dropped the overhead arm swing to start the delivery. The number of pitches he lost to mechanical failure (I swear, a pitch per batter in the 7/24 game...so bad) went down, though he's still got problems with it. He was even using the change a little more frequently by the 9/29 start. Coop's trying to change him into a legit 4 pitch pitcher with command and the results are pretty obvious when you watch.
If he's showing the command of the slider next year, he can be effective and may be the 4.25 ERA Cheat was talking about. He was even more than that for his last five starts, getting into 1-2 range with that 3.12 ERA.
by colintj on
Nov 20, 2007 8:55 PM CST
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Haha, Kenny called Cabrera...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 1:18 AM CST
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The idea for competing next year makes sense
But I have to say that 2010 looks kinda bleak. 2009 is a "eh... maybe" for me right now, but 2010 doesn't look good.
I like that Kenny is trying to compete next year instead of stock piling more prospects for 2009, 2010 seasons that may or may not pan out. Consider that Thome will likely be reduced to spending most of his days on the DL, Konerko will probably keep sucking like he did last year, and Dye will be in a wheelchair. To my knowledge, the Sox don't really have any good 1B prospects. AJ sure as heck isn't getting any younger either.
Just saying... I like the idea of competing next year. Makes a lot more sense than trying to compete in 2009, 2010 when our offensive core is even older and slower.
That we could've gotten more short term for Jon Garland I don't know. OC looks pretty decent to me.
by Shoeless In SC on
Nov 20, 2007 7:31 AM CST
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Who knows about 2010
Since it appears unlikely that Williams will bring in a LF'r, maybe it's not the worst idea to give the job to Owens first. Perhaps they can get him to drag bunt every other at bat. If he falters plug in Posednick (4th outfielder) and see if he can't regain the '05 magic. And if both fail (probably about a 50% chance), then you MUST make a deadline trade for a leadoff hitter, assuming the team is still in it.
While I'd rather see the Sox sign Fukudome, we aren't the Yankees and signing someone like Hunter caps the big spending.
by rhombusface on
Nov 20, 2007 9:36 AM CST
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Losing Patience Quickly with KW
The only way this deal somehow comes close to being good value for the Sox is if Cabrera is deemed a class "A" FA and the Sox get the sandwich pick. So possibly in two years the Sox get a prospect.
Hurray! Whoopteedohurray!
I've come around to the fact that Uribe will never become even a homeless man's Tejada, but you don't trade a league average innings eater to upgrade SS from a 670 OPS to a 710 OPS. Especially, especially, and I cannot emphasize this enough: especially when this team desperately needs young position players NOW. Not in two years, but now.
I'm about sick of being a White Sox fan. I guess I'm just becoming a baseball fan these days. At least until the Sox show me something worth cheering for, not this aging garbage team meandering around .500 (if lucky) with no future.
by madvillian on
Nov 20, 2007 10:08 AM CST
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We just made sure the one guy we hate
by colintj on
Nov 20, 2007 12:47 PM CST
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If this happens, then this trade looks awful...
From Rob Neyer:
by BoKnows on
Nov 20, 2007 10:09 AM CST
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If that happens,
by ballyb on
Nov 20, 2007 10:16 AM CST
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Does that take into account
by palehose67 on
Nov 20, 2007 10:24 AM CST
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Probably not...
by BoKnows on
Nov 20, 2007 10:25 AM CST
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BJH Projections
For comparison's sake, Eckstein's '08 projection: .290/.352/.359/.711 with 11 steals.
I also noticed this morning that Eckstein has a career OPS+ of 89 to Cabrera's 86.
HOWEVER, Cabrera is one of the best baserunners in baseball (tied for 10th overall at +38); Eckstein not nearly as good (+8). And obviously the glove is better.
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 10:41 AM CST
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Uribe '08 projection
And in the Fielding Bible Awards, Cabrera finished 11th at SS; Uribe nowhere to be found.
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 10:49 AM CST
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What the hell
by BoKnows on
Nov 20, 2007 11:01 AM CST
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Neyer was the same fool
by southsideirish71 on
Nov 20, 2007 1:30 PM CST
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I simply do not believe that Eckstein
by palehose67 on
Nov 20, 2007 10:57 AM CST
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rob neyer should be smarter than this
by larry on
Nov 20, 2007 11:16 AM CST
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Some more info on Uribe's D.
Uribe has definitely lost a step as his girth has continued to increase. Fan's ratings, UZR and PMR all concur with that. Both PMR (Uribe -8, Cabrera +4) and UZR (Cabrera +6, Uribe something less than that) have Cabrera as the better fielder this past year. B pro has Cabrera at 0 BRAA and Uribe at -23. The total win difference is probably 2-3 wins even accounting for age related decline from O-cab. This is a pretty big improvement.
By the way Eckstein is worse than either of them (-10, -14, -9 runs by UZR, Fielding bible and PMR respectively).
by bhoov on
Nov 20, 2007 11:41 AM CST
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Rob Neyer is a douchebag
He may be a good writer and a very knowledgeable guy generally but this statement about Cabrera and Uribe is horseshit. Someone archive this and sti ck it in my face a year from now if I'm wrong, but this proclimation looks like a big reach for Mr. Neyer.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 12:30 PM CST
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Weren't we going on
by HulkSmash on
Nov 20, 2007 12:49 PM CST
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Assclown - great, underused slam.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 1:00 PM CST
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He's a Royals fan, what do you expect
I also have a personal axe to grind with him because he was one of the first to have his column switch to ESPN Insider only territory (may or may not have been by choice), so F*&# him and F%$* ESPN if they think I'm paying one red cent to that abomination of a network / website.
And no, I do not have cable or a dish, so I'm not half the hypocrite I am assuming that you are assuming I am ;)
by rhythm on
Nov 20, 2007 1:37 PM CST
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l like Neyer
by Tdogg on
Nov 20, 2007 1:37 PM CST
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From MLB TradeRumors.com
by ballyb on
Nov 20, 2007 10:10 AM CST
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Uribe for Howell
1. Look for failing starters in other organizations, especially strike-throwers.
- Don't just drop somebody into the eighth inning
- Look for pitchers with deception in their delivery or repertoire
- Stay away from the top end of the reliever free-agent market
- Failing starter? Check. 33 starts, 6.5 ERA. Strike thrower, Check. Or he looks to be developing the ability to throw strikes more regularly. 145/34 K/BB in 128 AAA innings last year.
- No prob. We've got MacDougal and Thornton to blow the 8th inning
- As I recall, Howell is a change-up pitcher. No funky delivery, but he definitely uses deception.
- does not apply...
by The Cheat on
Nov 20, 2007 12:26 PM CST
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LOL on #2
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 12:31 PM CST
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It would be a nice little trade...
I was wondering if Kenny would ever go after a guy like Elijah Dukes. He would look nice in LF. I guess Rocco Baldelli may actually be more realistic.
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 12:35 PM CST
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No, and NO!
No, thanks. Why do you think Crawford's practically untouchable? Because they can't count on either Baldelli or Dukes.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 12:45 PM CST
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Dukes would be worth a gamble...
by Serpiente on
Nov 20, 2007 1:44 PM CST
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I like winning...
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 1:45 PM CST
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Both Babe Ruth and Mickey Mantle...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 1:53 PM CST
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I don't recall hearing about either of them
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 2:18 PM CST
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Not a moralizer, I
Give it up, SSH.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 2:46 PM CST
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The Sox can't afford to be picky...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 3:25 PM CST
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Stark? Folsom? Joliet? Rykers?
Attica! Attica!
SSH, the phone is ringing. It's for you. It's Hugo Chavez offering employment.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 3:38 PM CST
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You won't be laughing in 2008...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 3:41 PM CST
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Actually, that mental image is funny
by rhythm on
Nov 20, 2007 4:50 PM CST
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that would certainly add speed to our lineup
by larry on
Nov 20, 2007 5:03 PM CST
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wait...
The more I think about it, the more I like this idea.
by Hazymania on
Nov 20, 2007 8:23 PM CST
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you may be on to something here!
by The Wizard on
Nov 21, 2007 1:43 PM CST
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Also, the Phillies missed out on Mike Lowell...
The Red Sox third baseman was reportedly offered four years at $50 million."
Trade Crede to the Phillies for reliever.
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 10:30 AM CST
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KW
Playoff team in warm weather with boatloads of prospects and cash vs. well, a .444 winning percentage over the last season and a half, a few prospects, and half a clubhouse who qualifies for the Senior Grand Slam at Denny's.
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 12:10 PM CST
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You have completely
Bastard. Now get to work, Mr. Govt. Wonk. And don't let me catch you walking down the South Side unprotected. Enjoy your Chablis with Jon G.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 12:33 PM CST
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I'm just sayin...
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 12:51 PM CST
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If the $ is equal,
Plus, the Angels are the Left Coast version of the Yankees as of late - make the playoffs and flame out early. The Sox bring it home (every 88 years), baby!
Don't sell your Sox short, big man. Lots of folks love us.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 12:59 PM CST
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Yeah,
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 1:04 PM CST
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Sure - but you do spend
Still can't believe you're defecating all over your city/team a scant few months after leaving. Ashamed you should be. Lighting a candle for your soul am I.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 1:08 PM CST
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Not defecating.
Come come on now, are you really excited about the 2008 prospects after the last season and a half? I swore the night the Sox won the World Series that I didn't care if they'd ever win another game. But that was bull--I want sustained success. I want the Bulls of the 90s, the Bears of the 40s, and the Boilermakers of the...well, you get my point.
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 1:16 PM CST
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If you were three inches in front
You are no worse than any other fan who has tasted success - it's like blow (I imagine) in tat you can't have enough but fades after sustained experience. I'd like to win, too. I don't believe too many thought we could win it all in '05. You never know. So at least being interesting is preferable to last year's total boring, predictable ennui.
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 1:37 PM CST
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I hope you're right,
by Toonderstrook on
Nov 20, 2007 1:40 PM CST
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Sources: Tribe near deal with Kobayashi...
by SSH2005 on
Nov 20, 2007 12:27 PM CST
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Is Kaiser Souze a throw-in?
by winningugly on
Nov 20, 2007 12:34 PM CST
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Nobody believed he was real. Nobody ever saw him
by colintj on
Nov 20, 2007 12:38 PM CST
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He'll flip ya.
by BustedFlush on
Nov 20, 2007 1:24 PM CST
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Fuck your father in the shower and have a snack
by colintj on
Nov 20, 2007 4:20 PM CST
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My name is...
by bhoov on
Nov 20, 2007 1:49 PM CST
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