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Around SBN: Ohio State And Florida Target 2013 Receiver Recruits

What velocity drop Ned? He's fine. He hit 94 on Sunday.

Tony Jackson of the LA Daily News says the Dodgers have shifted their focus away from acquiring a bat to a pitcher. One of the pitchers they're looking at is KC's Octavio Dotel:

The Dodgers also have heavily scouted the Chicago White Sox, probably with a focus on right-handed starter Jose Contreras. But he is 35 and is owed $20 million over the next two seasons, and his velocity has dropped considerably.

A source close to the White Sox said the club might want Dodgers shortstop prospect Chin-lung Hu, the Most Valuable Player of Sunday's All-Star Futures Game. But Hu is another player the Dodgers aren't likely to deal.

*****

In other things, Jim has some timely videos: Ehren Wassermann, Carlos Vasquez and Paulino Reynoso. And Jeeves tries to pick Kenny's mind.

Update: It's Wassermann:

The Chicago White Sox optioned right-handed pitcher Nick Masset to Class AAA Charlotte following last night's victory at Cleveland and purchased the contract of right-handed pitcher Ehren ("Aaron") Wassermann from Charlotte prior to tonight's game with the Indians. To make room for Wassermann on the 40-man roster, the White Sox transferred third baseman Joe Crede from the 15-day to the 60-day disabled list.
*****

As SSH2005 mentioned, Phil Rogers says that Arizona was showcasing Conor Jackson at LF for the Sox on Monday. They're also shopping Carlos Quentin. And with the emergence of Justin Upton they may consider moving Chris Young.

*****

And a little plug. The other day I downloaded the latest release of SeaMonkey. SeaMonkey is the continuation of the Mozilla Web Browser. One of the new features I find most useful is the real time spellchecker (it wasn't build in previous releases). It spellchecks every form you fill, like the message boxes here and in every other message board. If you type something that's misspelled, it underlines it with a red line, so you can fix it before hitting post. Very useful.

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So wait
what the hell does SeaMonkey actually do?  And what is it?  Firefox already has a built in spell check, btw.

by colintj on Jul 17, 2007 1:25 PM CDT reply actions  

SeaMonkey is a web browser
like mozilla, with both browser and e-mail together

I mentioned it because I find the real time spellchecker

maybe firefox has it too
I don't know because I haven't tried firefox any time lately
I did once (I think a couple years ago), didn't like it and kept kept mozilla/seamonkey

by The Wizard on Jul 17, 2007 1:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Also, Hu pretty much fits the bill
wrt our team needs.  He was renowned for his glove and now he's found his bat.  I think I'd send both JD and Contreras for him.

by colintj on Jul 17, 2007 1:26 PM CDT reply actions  

I can't help it -
every time I see the name Ned it conjures uop 2 images:
  1.  Ringmaster Ned on Bozo's Circus.
  2.  Ned Beatty in "Deliverance".
Heh, heh.  What about you, Butthead?  Heh, heh.  "Deliverance."

So I can't take this seriously.

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 1:27 PM CDT reply actions  

Wasserman #62 - Official
Finally posted on White Sox

Excuse me if this was already posted

White Sox baseball, let the kids learn to play

by Brush Back on Jul 17, 2007 1:37 PM CDT reply actions  

Sorry - correct link
Correct link #62
White Sox baseball, let the kids learn to play

by Brush Back on Jul 17, 2007 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

RotoWorld mini-article
http://rotoworld.com/content/Headlines.aspx?sport=MLB&hl=216833
"P.S. if Cintron gets traded or released I will buy drinks for the whole board" - tubesox 6/24/07

by mjthor on Jul 17, 2007 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think they want Garland...
But I would want both Conor Jackson AND Carlos Quentin so we can completely rebuild our corner outfield.

Garland, Dye, and a pitching prospect for Jackson and Quentin?

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Garland
alone is worth Jackson, Quentin and a prospect. Jackson and Quentin's prospect standing has diminished as they've been pretty average thus far in mlb. But they still project better than anybody in our system (except maybe sweeney). And they clearly project better than Sweeney for '08.

But to give up Garland I would want another prospect (Callaspo?). Wouldn't mind throwing JD in there to clear room for quentin/jackson, but definitely no pitching prospect (unless you consider heath phillips a prospect!)  

by bhoov on Jul 17, 2007 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I honestly don't think that...
A season and a half of Garland at over $15 million dollars is worth Jackson, Quentin, and a prospect.

Quentin has been mediocre in the majors but Jackson was good last season and is having a good season this year (albeit, with little power).  They are both still young as well and are making nothing.  I think that is a bit much to ask for a season and a half of Garland.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 2:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

We'll have to agree to disagree and....
see what happens. But if 1 season of an 88 mph Freddy Garcia is worth gio and floyd, then 1.5 years of a healthy Garland at below market price is worth a lot more.

Remember Ted Lilly got 10 million a year for 4 years. In some ways a 1.5-2 year contract for a pitcher is a good thing. Long enough to get value form him, but short enough to avoid sig. injury risk.

by bhoov on Jul 17, 2007 2:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Garcia trade was panned on the Sox end...
when it went down.  Everyone said that the Sox didn't get back enough for a quality starter.  It looks good now but that's because both Gio and Floyd are having good seasons in AA and AAA respectively and Freddy is likely done for the season.  The media apparently was unaware of Freddy's loss of velocity and obvious injury that almost every Sox fan could see as plain as day.

I could see Garland and Dye possibly netting Jackson and Quentin (I still think we would need to throw in a prospect) but I don't see Garland alone being worth Jackson, Quentin, plus a prospect like Callapso.  That seems ridiculous to me -- we would be getting three starting position players from Arizona for a year and a half of Garland.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 2:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

I might check your history
"Everyone" is a dangerous term to use, but in this case is patently inaccurate.  Yes, there were some who thought we could've gotten more, but I do believe many, if not most, though getting rid of a dying Freddy for anything of value(and we had Gio-lovers back then, too) was a worthwhile transaction.  The Floyd portion was questioned but the deal overall was received positively.

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

think he means
everyone in the media.
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yep, that's what I meant...
Anyways, I would love to get Jackson and Quentin back if possible.  I will take an outfield of Jackson, Sweeney, and Quentin for 2008, defense be damned.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

And honestly, with the way Sweeney...
has looked in CF when he has played there, the only downside defensively with such an outfield would be Jackson in LF.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

What an effin' merry-go-round
To Gio or not to Gio?  To Rowand or not to Rowand?  To Danks or not to Danks?  These are the questions.  Sometimes I think KW has a set of Strat-o-Matic cards (look it up) and some dice.

I'm getting the bends.  And yet Pablito and Pods are rooted like effin' oaks.

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 2:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

What use would we have for either
Quentin or Jackson?  If Quentin can't hit for power, then we've already got a better version of him in Sweeney, who can play center.  Jackson can't play anything but LF or 1B and, again, hits for no power.  I have pretty much zero interest in either of those dudes.

by colintj on Jul 17, 2007 3:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Who the F
does the drafting for Arizona? Why don't we hire these guys and Minnesota's player development people. We have alot more money than either organization and can offer a home base of a world class city like Chicago.

by ballyb on Jul 17, 2007 2:18 PM CDT reply actions  

draft position and bud/reinsdorf
Arizona has had a lot of top ten picks to acquire their talent (Drew, Upton to name 2). They also have been given freedom to draft pricey picks/Boras clients (Drew). The sox have had neither of those things.

And a number of their draft picks are struggling (Jackson, Quentin) which is why they're available. And of course We DID draft one of their developing young players. Oh and although they have a number of position prospects they have almost no pitching prospects. They would kill to have Danks, Gio and Fautino. Of course I still rank their system well ahead of ours (if only because of Upton), just pointing out their system does have holes.

All told I don't think evaluation of talent has played a huge role in the difference's between our farm systems.

Now Minnesota? You might have a point there.

by bhoov on Jul 17, 2007 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

yeah
arizona has got cash to spend and, when some of those players were drafted, probably threw their money around even more. we are talking about a team that during the colangelo era had payrolls above $100 million.
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 2:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

They may not lack young pitching for long
rotoworld suspects that Danks is the DBacks target in return for Conor Jackson...

by hitlesswonder on Jul 17, 2007 2:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

no way
the sox trade danks for that. i'm not saying he's untouchable - no one is with KW - but you're going to have to do better than that to prise him.
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, I wouldn't do it...
Danks for a young 1B/LF/DH that hasn't exactly demolished the competition...no. But KW has surprised me in the past with what players he has really fallen for, and Thome will likely be gone after 2008 (?). So, I'm just a little anxious.

I would consider dealing Danks for MLB players at hard to fill positions. Danks for Salty and Escobar...that would be a deal I'd consider.

by hitlesswonder on Jul 17, 2007 4:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Supposedly...
Jackson is a terrible left fielder, and only competent at first.

I keep hearing that he'll develop power, but until he does, he's not a very valuable player.  

I'd gladly give up Contreras for him.  One of the younger guys, not so much.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Jul 17, 2007 4:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Then you may as well trash the trade rumor...
because Kenny won't be trading Danks.  And I don't see Vazquez going back to a team he demanded to be traded from.

Arizona has their choice of Contreras or Garland.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 3:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

how does that make any sense?
it doesn't fill any need and creates a new one.  that'd be idiotic of kenny and he usually doesn't do anything that blatantly wrong.

by colintj on Jul 17, 2007 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Mike Rizzo until last August
....when the Nationals hired him.

Mike Rizzo used to be a White Sox scout.

by asinwreck on Jul 17, 2007 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ehren must change spelling to Aaron
More grindy!
President - Johnny Dickshot Fan Club

by tailgater on Jul 17, 2007 2:56 PM CDT reply actions  

He must not be grindy enough
you have to achieve a certain level of grindy-ness to be bestowed the honor of using the aaron name

by The Wizard on Jul 17, 2007 2:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

Perhaps he can earn the honor
by drilling the first batter he faces right in the head.
President - Johnny Dickshot Fan Club

by tailgater on Jul 17, 2007 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

red herring
we all know a pitcher can't be a grinder. especially one who throws sidearm.
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 3:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

1908
"Big Ed" Walsh pitched 464 innings with a 1.42 ERA. Now THAT'S grindy!

Sure, it was 99 years ago, but what the hell.

President - Johnny Dickshot Fan Club

by tailgater on Jul 17, 2007 3:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

he did throw a spitball
personally, i think the outlawing of that pitch is the demarcation for when pitchers stopped being grinders.
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 3:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

Bob Gibson and Don Drysdale were
grinders.  Clemens used to be a grinder until he was able to fly his own plane for half a season's labor.  Wilbur Wood, in his day, was a grinder.

See, I think the line o' demarcation was when pitchers didn't have to bat any more.  So the NL pitchers are definitely grindier than the AL pitchers.

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 3:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

We can jest now
but you do realize that if Big Ed were alive and you commented that he pitched underhand (i.e., "like a girl") he would probably snap your neck like a chicken bone.

As we all know, those guys didn't get paid much, they actually loved the game and they didn't like to be f***ed with.

President - Johnny Dickshot Fan Club

by tailgater on Jul 17, 2007 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Or "Aron"
Like Elvis' middle name (the "EE-per", as Steve Dahl used to call him).

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Steve Dahl
Not to show my age...but I still have my Insane Coho Lips membership card.
President - Johnny Dickshot Fan Club

by tailgater on Jul 17, 2007 3:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

As do I
and the Disco Still Sucks 25th anny T-Shirt.

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 3:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's an insult
to fecal greaseballs.
President - Johnny Dickshot Fan Club

by tailgater on Jul 17, 2007 5:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ha!
Wouldn't it be great if we could buy low on Chris Young? What would it take to get him at this point?

He's had 372 at bats over two seasons and has hit an "Anderson-esque" .239/.287/.425 for a .712 OPS in a hitters park in the weaker league. he's a worse option that Terrero at this point.

Looks like another Jeremy Reed, folks. Does Kenny know when to deal 'em, or what?

Actually, Kenny could probably reacquire Jeremy Reed for a "C" prospect like Lucas Harrell or a bum like Masset. What would it take to get Young? McCulloch or Broadway might do it, and Tadahito certainly would.

Also, look at how far Carlos Quentin has fallen: .210/.299/.350 in 200 ABs. What would it take to get the both of them and hope for a bounceback?

by Stealfirstbase on Jul 17, 2007 2:58 PM CDT reply actions  

i haven't watch much d-backs this year
anyone know what's up with young? has he reverted to his undisciplined ways at the plate?
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 3:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Did you load up on QCOM,
CMGI, AOL, or any of the other fallen angels after the tech debacle?  Sometimes fallen angels don't get up and deserve to be left behind.

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

You've got to be kidding...
Chris Young for Iguchi is a done deal?  You must be hungover.  Smart teams don't bench guys after a half-season's worth of struggles.  The kid is what, 22 years old, and already he's a bust?  Yikes.

by CWSKeith on Jul 17, 2007 3:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Iguchi would certainly be enough for Chris Young?
Man, Stealfirstbase, sorry to say this but you need to go buy a clue.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 3:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Especially when Arizona has both...
Orlando Hudson and Alberto Callapso and just traded us a 2B prospect.  Yeah, they really need and want a 2B right about now.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Because I don't follow the Braves
I hadn't noticed, but Yunel Escobar is definitely being showcased in ATL. From an angry Braves fan at BBTF:
You call that showcasing? That's nothing compared with the full scale PR job the Braves are doing to try and sell the White Sox on Yunel Escobar. Kelly Johnson is second in the NL in OPS at second base and hasn't started since Friday.
Escobar started each of the last 3 games at 2B, and went 6 for 13 with a walk, 3 strikeouts, and a sacrifice. He was also put in as a defensive replacement at SS on Friday, and played part of the game there monday.
AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on Jul 17, 2007 3:00 PM CDT reply actions  

Escobar would make a lot of sense for us...
to go along with Richar in our middle infield but I need more than just him.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 3:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Anyone
else notice that Sweeney hit a dinger for the second day in a row, giving him seven? Richar also continues to hit....noticed they play him at short when the great Tomas Perez sits...he made his third error today....don't know where he made the other two.

by dantesox on Jul 17, 2007 3:58 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wow, Richar with a 2-run homer...
This dude needs to be called up soon.  I think we may have seen the last of Iguchi.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 4:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

I've also noticed
that he's hit a total of 5 HR away from his home park the last two seasons.

On the plus side, he's really increased his walk rate lately, and showed a better-than-expected batting eye in his brief call-up this year. I think he'll continue to walk more in the future.

I'd expect a .265/.310/.350 line if he played in the bigs next year, maybe .285/.345/.385 in his second season before finally starting to put together something like .290/.370/.450 around age 25 or so..

AIM: SouthSideCheat

by The Cheat on Jul 17, 2007 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

I was actually hoping that meant
that KJ was available.  Maybe Richar is a two year fill in, but KJ would be a 5 year plus at a defense-first position.  

by colintj on Jul 17, 2007 3:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Kelly Johnson
also has been playing like garbage for the last month or so.
"P.S. if Cintron gets traded or released I will buy drinks for the whole board" - tubesox 6/24/07

by mjthor on Jul 17, 2007 4:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Man, look at Kelly Johnson's line on the season...
.287 AVG / .390 OBP / .465 SLG / .855 OPS

They are definitely showcasing Yunel Escobar.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed - I watch him on TBS
and he's stout, as they say in the South.  He'd look good in place of Gooch.  And it ain't gonna happen.

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

We don't need Kelly Johnson...
Although he would be nice to have.  We already have Richar.  We need a shortstop (like Escobar).

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 4:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Define "tearing it up"
He's not driving in or scoring that many runs, not hitting for power, not stealing bags...
"P.S. if Cintron gets traded or released I will buy drinks for the whole board" - tubesox 6/24/07

by mjthor on Jul 17, 2007 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

i hope so
Escobar/Richar up the middle next year and into the future would be nice.
Go Badgers!

by shaftr on Jul 17, 2007 4:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Are all of these teams showcasing for us?
Rockies recalled RHP Ubaldo Jimenez from Triple-A Colorado Springs.
The Rockies probably just wanted a long man for the next couple of days after Taylor Buchholz's poor outing Monday. Jimenez, who had a 5.85 ERA in 19 starts in the minors, could return to Triple-A when Brian Fuentes is activated.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 3:38 PM CDT reply actions  

If the Sox are dealing Vazquez or Garland...
I think I'd want more than Jimenez back. Is that unreasonable? He supposedly has a great arm and I'm sure he's hurt by park effects. But that BB rate is NOT good. Enough with the hard throwers that need their control "fixed".

by hitlesswonder on Jul 17, 2007 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not at all...
Either Vazquez or Garland would cost more than Jimenez.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 4:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Am I the only one getting ancy?
I want to see something happen, but I bet these next two weeks til the trading deadline are going to move at a snail's pace.  Kenny should be fielding offers for anybody and everybody that doesn't figure to be of much use to the next White Sox team that is good.  Maybe I'm being naive here, but I think guys like Mackowiak, Thorton and MacDougal could net a decent return (one B or C+ prospect).  I also can't express how happy I am that Dye has finally turned it on.  Come on, Jermaine -- two more weeks of hitting .350, that's all I ask

by CWSKeith on Jul 17, 2007 4:50 PM CDT reply actions  

Antsy, bro
Like "ants in your pants".  And "23 skidoo".

Kids....

by winningugly on Jul 17, 2007 5:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed, I can't wait to see some...
good young talent brought here for our aging veterans.

But I don't see Kenny trading either Thornton or MacDougal.  Both are locked up to cheap deals, have good stuff, and could easily have good bounceback 2008 seasons.  Remember, MacDougal was dealing with a minor injury (although that could be a good reason for trading him).  But I don't think that I would trade them either.  Why sell low on them when they have a lot more potential than what they have shown this season?  It's not like they are expensive.

Kenny should look to trade Dye, Contreras, Mackowiak, Iguchi, and possibly Garland.  And if Kenny thinks that he can extend Garland, he should probably look to deal Vazquez instead.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 5:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

1 of Garland or Vazquez must go
to bring back some good young talent. Dye and Contreras might bring back an A prospect if someone wants to deal.

by omnipotent grab on Jul 17, 2007 5:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

I just hope he doesnt let good deals pass
because he thinks he can get better deals for our crappy players.

by omnipotent grab on Jul 17, 2007 5:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Re. tonight's game.
Paul Byrd (7-4, 4.41 ERA)
Byrd is 6-2 with a 4.61 ERA in 10 career starts against Chicago.
vs.
Jon Garland (7-6, 3.85 ERA).
Garland is 7-10 lifetime when facing Cleveland, and 4-5 with a 6.03 ERA at Jacobs Field.

by ballyb on Jul 17, 2007 4:58 PM CDT reply actions  

Conor Jackson
minor league numbers: .332 average .423 OB% (3 seasons)
I like this kid, hes 24, and is starting to figure it out. Hes only got 26 Ks in 244 ABs on the year. Him and Quentin would absolutely be worth Garland. The D-Backs have tons of guys Id take with Jackson for Garland.

by Gus on Jul 17, 2007 5:24 PM CDT reply actions  

Garland for Conor Jackson and Carlos Quentin...
would be a major heist, IMO.  I would love to see it happen but I doubt that it does.  In one trade, we would be completely rebuilding our outfield for the present and future...

LF  Conor Jackson
CF  Ryan Sweeney / Luis Terrero platoon
RF  Carlos Quentin

Me likey.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 5:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

No shit.
That is a heist. I'd take either one and Callaspo for Garland. Right now.

by dantesox on Jul 17, 2007 6:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think I would make that deal as well...
as long as Callaspo can play a competent SS so Richar can play 2B.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 6:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Arizona does not need a starter
  1. B. Webb
  2. R. Johnson-out till end of July, Yusmeiro Petit filling in
  3. L. Hernandez
  4. D. Davis
  5. M. Owings
This deal is for Dye strait up.
FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 5:30 PM CDT reply actions  

that
is not particularly good evidence that the dbacks don't need starting pitching. davis of his 1.72(!) WHIP? johnson of his hurt back, leg, whatever? youngsters of their, um, youngness?
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 5:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well
Doug Davis isn't exactly a nobody he has handled himself very nicely over the pass 4 years.  I don't care what his WHIP is its always been high.  If you look and his career numbers you see that he still got the job done even with his deficiencies.

Yusmeiro Petit a projected #1 starter in the big leagues is handling himself very well in place of Randy.  He still only 23.  I can easily put two and two together and gather that this showcasing does not involve one of our starters.  Arizona's offence has been absolutely dismal of late that need a experienced run producer to plug in the line up.  Again when I put two and two together the trade seems pretty obvious to me

FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 5:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

In what world...
is Petit a future number one starter?  You're talking about the guy who was traded straight up, IIRC, for Jorge Julio.

I'm sort of weary about some of those Arizona prospects.  The environment they play in in the minors (PCL, Texas League, Cal League) can really distort the numbers of those guy.  I thought I read at BTF that the average hitter playing in the conditions that the Arizona prospects play in is a .300 hitter.

by CWSKeith on Jul 17, 2007 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Before he got traded to Arizona
He was the Rangers #1 prospect and a projected #1 or 2 starter.  
FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 6:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

I mean the Mets
FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 6:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I always thought Petit...
was supposed to be a back of the rotation starter at best.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 6:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

From the blogs Favoriite site
The hardball Times

Much of the talk surrounding Yusmeiro Petit is about his flaws. He's not very tall and could stand to work out more, doesn't throw particularly hard and lives on the edge as an extreme fly-ball pitcher. While all of that may indeed keep him from becoming a true ace, his performance has been consistently extraordinary. In 346 career innings Petit has a 2.76 ERA with a 429-to-75 strikeout-to-walk ratio and has allowed just 250 hits. Last season at Double-A he went 9-3 with a 2.91 ERA and 130-to-18 strikeout-to-walk ratio in 117.2 innings, holding opponents to a .209 batting average. And unlike some iffy prospects who pad their stats against less experienced competition, Petit doesn't turn 22 years old until November.

Petit succeeds because he has an expansive repertoire of pitches that he can throw for strikes, has a good approach to pitching, and hides the ball very well with his delivery. Those things aren't going to go away just because he's facing better competition, and while a few of the long fly-ball outs he gets now will turn into homers in the majors, I'm confident he can become a solid second starter. Typically when a prospect becomes a "stathead favorite" he is a little too old or is lacking in something significant like defensive ability. Petit is lacking only in fastball velocity, but he's far from a soft-tosser, is only 21 years old, and ... well, his stats are really good.

FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 6:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Petit
In 2006, Petit pitched about 120 innings between AAA and Florida, combining for an ERA of around 5.00 with under 8 Ks/9.  

He has had a decent season this year, especially in the environment he's throwing in, but he's still not striking out anybody and his K/BB ratio isn't even two.  He's a decent prospect, especially because of how young he is, but he's nowhere near a "future number one starter".

by CWSKeith on Jul 17, 2007 6:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

He's definitely not a #1 or 2 now
but he was once projected to be.  Now at ripe age of 23 he seems to be settling in at the big.  All I was saying is Arizona will probably go with him over Contreras at this point.

Gavin Floyd was once thought to be a number #1 or #2 starter and look what happened.  

FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions  

FWIW
Sickels had Petit as a B+ prospect back when he was with the Mets. And Owings was a B most recently. Sickels wasn't projecting either of those guys to be a "#1" or "#2" starter anywhere. And Petit's stock has obviously dropped since then -- scouts never liked his lack of "stuff". Being traded for Julio tells you a lot about his perceived value. That's not to ding Petit, he may turn out to be great, but I agree that the baseball world does not come close to holding him and Phillip Hughes in the same esteem.

by hitlesswonder on Jul 17, 2007 6:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

Also
Owings has been one of the few starters in baseball worse than Contreras in july with a 10.64 ERA. And that's in an easier league while facing pitchers.

by bhoov on Jul 17, 2007 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

Owings
Owings is a top pitching prospect Arizona isn't going to give up on him to trade for broken down  Contreras and his salary.  Plus wouldn't trade any of our starter for Conor because I'm not sure he's any good.  You can get much more for Contreras.

I hope the trade does not involves one of our established major league starter for a player who is questionable offensively. If it does then I will have to question Kenny Williams mental capacity.

FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 6:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

If you think we can get more for...
a 50 year old Contreras with a 5.32 ERA and $20+ million remaining on his contract than a young, cheap 1B/LF with good numbers in Conor Jackson, you need to lay off the pipe.

Granted, Jackson is having a down year (.761 OPS) but he put up an .809 OPS in his first full season last year.  He is still young and has room to improve, based on his .953 OPS in the minors.  He has exactly what our team needs -- a high OBP and youth.

You have to factor in Contreras' old ass age, declining stuff, contract, and crappy numbers this season before expecting a large return for him in a trade.

But we will see if you are correct when you say that we "can get can much more for Contreras."  If you really believe that, I have a feeling that you are going to be very disappointed come July 31st.

by SSH2005 on Jul 17, 2007 6:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again
I am no saying Contreras is worth the whole farm.  All I'm saying is he's worth more than Conor.  I would do Kemp or Milleage strait up.
FORGIVE ME GREG WALKER FOR I HAVE SINNED. IT'S BEEN A YEAR SINCE I CONSISTENTLY HIT THE BALL.

by chisox on Jul 17, 2007 7:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

Have you seen Kemp's numbers so far?
Matt Kemp's stats

The Dodgers aren't giving him up for awful, old, and expensive Contreras.

Contreras for Milledge might be possible though.  Although, I don't see how Milledge is any better than Jackson.

by SSH2005 on Jul 18, 2007 10:13 AM CDT up reply actions  

no one is asking
arizona to "give up" on anyone. if you think a team interested in making the playoffs won't add starting pitching -especially with that rotation - you're crazy. it's a nice rotation. but i wouldn't bank on winning a playoff series with those.
Free Ehren Wasserman!

by larry on Jul 17, 2007 6:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Apropos of nothing...
Arizona's bullpen has put up some pretty great numbers this year.  I'm pretty jealous.

by The Jerry Royster Experience on Jul 17, 2007 6:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

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